US Soldier Waterboards 4-Year-Old Daughter For Not Reciting ABC's | 46 comments (46 topical, 0 hidden)
This has been going on forever, Smokin... (none / 1)
I think its awful that this little girl had to endure such punishment. It is totally unjustified and should be punished appropriately...

But please understand that water boarding has been practiced for CENTURIES! In its current form, the way we know it, has been handed down from regime to regime stretching from China, Russia, the Middle East and America.

The North Vietnamese VC troops would do this routinely to our soldiers in an effort to extract strategic location info - They learned it from the Chinese, who have nearly perfected torture methods for the last 400 years.

I hate how everyone thinks that water boarding only occurred during the Bush years - it has been happening since the Civil War in this country, if not earlier! The only reason we know about it now is that wonderful circulation of knowledge called the internet...

Torture has always been used. It will always be utilized if the need arises. People who oppose it are truly justified in their beliefs, but they are also truly being unrealistic to think that we can make it go away.

We can't, and we won't - its too valuable a tool to let go...

:(

by bobo1 on 02/08/2010 06:55:15 PM EST

[ Parent ]
Other "valuable tools" (none / 1)
But please understand that water boarding has been practiced for CENTURIES!

So has rape.

So has spousal abuse.

So has genocide.

So has corruption.

So has theft.

So has murder.

by OneHitKill on 02/08/2010 07:48:37 PM EST

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And have we been successful... (none / 1)
At eliminating any of those?

My point exactly - stop bellyaching, put your big girl panties on and immerse yourself in the real world...

Welcome...

:)

by bobo1 on 02/08/2010 07:58:01 PM EST

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Lackadaisy (none / 1)
Successful or not, we haven't stopped trying to eliminate them, and I doubt we ever will. Get on board already. Your attitude is unacceptably lazy.

by OneHitKill on 02/08/2010 08:10:02 PM EST

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My attitude... (none / 1)
Is completely realistic. As a teacher of history, I know that we will never eliminate the animal nature of human beings.

We must learn to regulate, legislate and adjust to the times, but eliminating anything on your list is out of reach and just silly to waste energy trying...

:)

by bobo1 on 02/08/2010 08:13:32 PM EST

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What horrible (none / 0)
Teachers America has, you should know we are products of our environment first and foremost. You idiots cultivate this type of behavior.

by Alloy on 02/08/2010 08:19:40 PM EST

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As a "teacher of history"... (none / 0)
...you should know the damn difference between waterboarding (torture) in the civil war and doing the same at Guantanamo.

Mainly that since the end of WW2, it has been an illegal act. Which wasn't the case so much in the times you refer to.

The question is: Why aren't the "Law and Order" types insisting on the law being followed and the perpetrators be brought into a courtroom - as the American Justice System calls for? Instead, we get excuses and justifications of "oh, it's always going to happen."

This whole sidetrack also begs the question: What does WW2 and Civil War waterboarding have to do with the near drowning of a young girl? Did she have vital information about a nuclear device set to go off on the playground in the next 24 Hrs??? An assasination plot against the student body president?

I would like to hear more of the background of this case - I think someone, somewhere, threw in "waterboarding" as a way to make the story "sexier"...

by MedfordTim on 02/08/2010 09:32:07 PM EST

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I certainly dont condone... (none / 1)
The violent act against this young girl, Tim. In no way is it ever justifiable to abuse a child.

I am merely stating the fact that the US has used torture methods throughout its history and its not going to stop because it happens to be "illegal."

The CIA, NSA and military work on their own rules - anyone who has ever dealt with these entities take that as a given. Its the common man, the people who don't know or who don't care to know who stand up and scream for justice. Their screams are falling on deaf ears.

Its not gonna change. Even if Obama were to go through and wipe the slate clean, convicting those who are guilty, it will always continue. That's how they get shit done.

I'm sorry that the truth hurts, Tim. I'm horrified that this child suffered this abuse, but perhaps we should look at the mental condition of the dad. He's PTSD for sure. What the Hell is he doing with a kid in his care???

by bobo1 on 02/08/2010 09:48:59 PM EST

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That's right, I said LAZY (none / 0)
This is the very same as you and your ilk's crusade against so-called "political correctness." You just label it an impassable barrier because that's the easiest way to avoid improving yourselves. You can't be bothered to try anything difficult. It's a wonder you ever learned to walk.

by OneHitKill on 02/08/2010 10:49:34 PM EST

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Bobo I keep trying to tell you (none / 0)
Waterboarding is not torture so you don't have to worry about "condoning" anything. As your man crush has pointed out on more than one occasion about waterboarding   "What we're currently debating is prosecuting government officials for making a few al Qaeda top bananas temporarily uncomfortable."

Yes TexiCon says, Waterboarding is fun! (none / 0)

Thousands of young idiots have tried waterboarding, and they agree that the process is mildly uncomfortable.
So this guy made his kid mildly uncomfortable, so it's no big deal. I don't even know why we are having a discussion about this.

"Although it is not true that all conservatives are stupid people, it is true that most stupid people are conservative." John Stuart Mill

by Hubble on 02/08/2010 11:08:47 PM EST

[ Parent ]
so by your logic... (none / 0)
we should just stop trying, right? i mean, those things are gonna happen anyway so why should we even bother? i'm pretty sure you just advocated complete anarchy. 

by voodoofrnchtoast on 02/09/2010 03:57:14 PM EST

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Its not about anarchy... (none / 0)
Its about being realistic in how we approach these issues.

Calling for torture to be ended is all well and good, but its silly to think that it can realistically be acheived.
Same thing goes for the other crimes Jesse listed.

We have punishments, we have rehabilitation, but when it comes right down to it, all of the good intention of our laws and people mean about didley squat...

I'm not calling for anarchy, I just want Liberals to get a clue (another thing that cannot happen, apparently...)

:)

by bobo1 on 02/09/2010 05:21:27 PM EST

[ Parent ]
"Getting a clue" (none / 0)
Odd considering that all the experts on interrogation adamantly oppose torture and call it ineffective and counter productive. There are literally thousands of crimes and cases we've conducted/interrogated without torture and have been successful, yet the standards and practice should change simply because the enemy is a Muslim?

What are you afraid of, do you really think Muslims have special powers and are so superior to you that they require a different set of interrogation techniques than the techniques that have proven to work? Its just ridiculous to suggest that you need torture when generals in the army say it will only lead to harm our soldiers.

Bobo, you are guilty of waterboarding a 4 year old girl IMHO, and you will be guilty for the torture our soldiers will face in future wars. You rot America and are a cancer to the ideals we should be protecting.

by Smokin on 02/09/2010 05:50:35 PM EST

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It irritates me... (none / 0)
...that you keep using a happy smiley face at the of your comments when the topic of discussion is a 4-year-old who got tortured by her father.

by mochalex on 02/09/2010 06:04:50 PM EST

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look (none / 0)
i'm just sayin that pretty much every single person who has that same thought process will be completely content with other people suffering while just blowing it off as "inevitable"..... until it happens to them. then they go overboard playing the victim and being outraged at the apathy being displayed to them, when it's exactly how they've been acting all along. the tragedy is that it takes some cruel thing happening to THOSE people before they seem to care. it's practically the same thing as not learning from other's experience. you say "history tells us that crime is inevitable and therefore it's pointless to try and prevent it/do anything about it." whereas i say if we didn't do anything, how much worse do you think it would be? i'm kinda seeing a real world version of Mad Max, or Fallout 3; pick your own apocalypse story. i'm just sayin something has to be done, regardless of how pointless it seems in the long run. if nothing else, it's creating jobs (cops, firemen, doctors, etc) and it might just be helping to keep the world a slightly better place than it could be. you republicans like to have "faith" and not "hope". not everybody can be saved, and not every crime can be prevented, but the fire victim who was rescued just in time, or the mugging victim who sees their assailants put in jail, or the rape victim who was on the verge of blowing her brains out til she spoke to a counsellor would probably disagree that we should just give up. 

by voodoofrnchtoast on 02/09/2010 11:53:49 PM EST

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Didn't the (none / 0)
US execute Chinese soldiers for water boarding ours?

by Alloy on 02/08/2010 08:16:21 PM EST

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Its very possible... (none / 0)
In what era are you referring to?

by bobo1 on 02/08/2010 08:30:41 PM EST

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"It's very possible"??? (none / 2)
Bobo,

He's asking about the Japanese soldiers the Allies executed after WW2 for the war crime of waterboarding and other tortures.

"It's very possible" we executed Chinese soldiers??? "In what ERA" is your question???

As a History teacher, you make a fine parking lot attendant...

by MedfordTim on 02/08/2010 09:38:29 PM EST

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No fuss (none / 0)
I'll bet he has his share of these.

by OneHitKill on 02/08/2010 10:52:19 PM EST

[ Parent ]

US Soldier Waterboards 4-Year-Old Daughter For Not Reciting ABC's | 46 comments (46 topical, 0 hidden)