Education and Healthcare | 6 comments (6 topical, 0 hidden)
Government is essential! (none / 0)
You have completely overlooked, among many things, financing those programs.  Putting a public utility into private hands is always more expensive and it always creates inefficiencies that would not otherwise exist.  Not only that, privatization of services that absolutely everyone needs always creates opportunities for corruption that otherwise would not exist.  And when corrupt influences effect public utilities, disaster is often the result because those utilities affect everyone, and the damage can be extreme.  If there's one thing that we should have learned from the Enron debacle and the mortgage market manipulations by the banks that were a major cause our current economic disaster, it's that putting that much power in private hands is never a good idea.

In healthcare, even though the right-wing is complaining that a "government run" system wouldn't allow you to see the doctor you want, that is exactly what is happening with private insurance, unless, of course, you jump through a lot of hoops, but even then it's not guaranteed.  What's more, we're paying extra for our health care because we're the one's who are paying for insurance companies' profits and for executives' bonuses.  Health care always will be rationed.  But government has an interest in keeping you healthy in order to minimize costs, while insurance companies' motive is to minimize health care services in order to maximize profits.

In education, which is something that absolutely everyone needs, no individual could afford the true cost of educating their children.  But since everyone benefits from having an educated population, even people who don't have children pay into the system.  And if taxpayers must pay for that system, they should own it.  There are no private universities that cost as relatively little as state universities do while providing not only the same quality of education but also the scientific research that spawns so much of our economic growth.  And while closing failing public schools rather than fixing them is all the rage nowadays, which virtually forces parents to seek seats for their children in for-profit schools, it is completely unnecessary.  We have dumbed down our schools by allowing religious doctrine to influence lesson plans and by discouraging people who would be good teachers from becoming teachers at such low pay to such a degree that we should be surprised that any of our children become more than hamburger flippers and hair stylists.  But instead of fixing that problem, you are advocating putting our children in private hands, at the mercy of the schools' boards of directors and stockholders.  What you want doesn't matter.  They will provide the minimum service that they can in order to maximize profits, or they will indoctrinate your child into an ideology that is nothing more than an intellectual handicap.

The marketplace is not the answer to all problems.  Your ideas are part of the problem.  You've surrendered to the myth that government -- you and I -- cannot do what needs to be done.  That is simply not true.

Quit surrendering to the right-wing.  Start using your power with your government to get it to do what you want it to do rather than surrender your power to the corporations.  Otherwise, you should give up all hope of having an effective voice in public affairs.

by EveningStarNM on 03/03/2011 06:26:46 PM EST

agree, they should be non profit (none / 0)

i agree that basic healthcare and education should be provisioned in non-profit, transparent way.  It's the specific details of how it's implemented that matter. 

 My main point is that if we can't get past words like public, private, as an issue of political left / right, then how can we even start the conversation?  Our we going to place ideology over analysis and discussion of solutions?

Are there things you allow the private sector to do? yes, they can do some effective programs that augment the core public service.  Would that be large corporations?  I would say that's a bad idea when it comes to education and healthcare.  But does that mean you can't hire private tutors, or a specialist doctor for your cosmetic surguery?

  I run a small business, many small, medium business exist of all shapes and sizes, and they do not have to be publicly traded corporations.  I think publicly traded corporations are the worst candidates for essential services, for the very good points you made.  But is there a way smaller private orgs get involved, if there is some transparency?  Think healthcare prevention as just one example of a beneficial service that might find a contract with smaller local private orgs.  Don't get stuck on false divisions, I know the details are tough, but can be more creative. We can do a lot better than this black and white world.

Look, we need to face that the world is too complex to fit into the boxes we make, like left, right, democrat, republican.  My point is, we need to make move the focus to solutions, not ideology.  Also that local representation is a critical balance to central power that is missing in this country.

by snellcode on 03/03/2011 07:51:58 PM EST

[ Parent ]
Yes, political identification is a problem (none / 0)
We often get distracted by ideology.  Liberalism, libertarianism, conservatism, and corporatism all focus on doctrinal structure rather than outcome.  And it's that belief in a doctrine that actually hinders us from focusing on pragmatics.  Rather than identify a problem, examine solutions, and select the one that benefits the most, hurts the least, and respects all people's rights, we argue about who is moral and who is immoral.

But that's why I'm a progressive.  I don't give a damn what the structure is.  If it works, fine.  If it doesn't then we need to change it.

But there are certain lessons that we have learned that there is no need to relearn, except that we keep making the same mistakes over and over and over.  Drug wars, permitting the accumulation of vast wealth in the hands of a few without imposing obligations to society at large, allowing corruption and influence peddling, and privatizing public utilities -- just to name a few.

I do understand your point about allowing private enterprises to provide services that they can do more efficiently.  They should provide those services to the government for fixed and limited terms.  For instance, the government has no business creating a public construction company for short-term projects, such as to build a power plant or a hospital.  A private construction company that already possesses the infrastructure necessary for the task and that will reuse it for other projects when this one is done is far more efficient.

But when it comes to actually providing electricity or medical services to the public at large, the public should own the infrastructure and provide those services to itself.  There is absolutely no need for privately-owned businesses to get involved in routine matters that affect everyone because they always want to change the routine in some why to benefit themselves more because that is what a private business is supposed to do.  When they mess with something that affects everyone, the result can be too catastrophic for the risk.

That doesn't mean that all doctors have to be government employees.  Personally, I don't think it's relevant who employs a doctor or if a doctor is completely self-employed.  Any qualified doctor should be able to practice in a public hospital.  But let them form a union and negotiate with the public the price of the services that they perform.  When what we're talking about is one continuing and routine but vital service (health care) to one customer (the public), the public should not divest itself of its right to absolute control of those services.

by EveningStarNM on 03/03/2011 10:44:30 PM EST

[ Parent ]
You are a bit over the top aren't you? (none / 0)

1.  Parochial schools provide a reasonably priced secular education to many children.

2.  Online schools are very cheap and most children do better than children taught in class.

3.  I don't recommend it, but Brigham Young provides a quality education at a state school price.

4.  There is no religious doctrine in our public schools unless you count secular religions.

5.  You are confusing regulation with ownership.  There are very few govt owned utilities.  Deregulation was the problem with Enron.

6.  Most mortgages were managed by Freddie and Fannie a quasi govt entity.

The problem is proper regulation.  With proper regulation, problems could be solved without centralization.

Join the 99%, Join Americans Elect and throw the bums out. Vote Mike Ballantine in 2012

by Mcamelyne II on 03/03/2011 09:57:22 PM EST

[ Parent ]

Education and Healthcare | 6 comments (6 topical, 0 hidden)