Fired and/or treason

Email Print posted by DrD 02/13/2007 08:14:23 AM EST

Google Technorati del.icio.us digg reddit
    Didn't Bush promise to fire anyone in his administration who outed a CIA agent?

    Now we have at least six members of the administration saying the spoke to reporters about Valerie Plame, or was it that six reporters said they heard it form different people in the administration? I do need to recheck those details, but that's not my point. My point is that more than one member of this administration outed a CIA agent and it seems that it was at the behest of Dick Cheney. Why hasn't Cheney been fired? Why haven't all the people who did the outing been brought up on treason charges? Randi Rhodes had said that Cheney was sending a message to anyone to the CIA that if you mess with the intel on Iraq, we'll expose your agents. Exposing a CIA agent can potentially get her killed -- so Randi was saying that the subtext of Cheney's message is you can get killed if you mess with us.  But this is something the Dems should be all over.
< I Call Bullshit on the Evidence Against Iran | Is the US gearing up for another war... with the Pentagon? >
 Display:
Fired and/or treason | 20 comments (20 topical, 0 hidden)
Fired AND treason (none / 0)
They should all stand trial for treason. That would be Cheney, Libby, Armitage, and Rove. And I believe that treason during 'wartime' is still a capital crime.

by Tergenev on 02/13/2007 02:03:52 PM EST

Treason (none / 0)

The United States code at (18 USC & 2381) states "whoever", owing allegiance to the United States, levies war against them or adheres to their enemies, giving them aid and comfort within the United States or elsewhere, is guilty of Treason and shall suffer death............there's more if your interested.

Rather vague at best, impossible to confict Chaney with the present Supreme Court and thats Not by accident. 

by DudsOne2 on 02/13/2007 02:39:46 PM EST

Could be easier than you would think (none / 0)

It all really comes down to how bad the political climate gets and how fed up people are.

IF there were fairly inarguable evidence Cheney had Plame outed as a slimy political trick

and

IF the people became really outraged about it

THEN Cheney could be conivcted even by this Supreme Court.

Here's why: (1) If things got really ugly (75+% of Americans think he commited treason) his political cover would disappear.  Look at Nixon or Bush.  Congressional Republican, if forced to choose between reelection and covering an outgoing VP will choose reelection.

(2) As for the Supreme Court.  All that would have to happen would be for people to begin talking about how wrong it would be for any Justice to sit in the trial who had recieved money, gifts or services from Cheney.  He has taken Justices on vacations (using our damn airplane, btw) and done various things with several justices where he (and we the taxpayers) have picked up the tab.

If those Justices begin to sense that sitting on the case and then voting pro-Cheney would create a significant public appearance of impropriety and subsequent impeachment, they would recuse themselves.

Now for the pargraph that no one will read.  I DO NOT PREDICT THIS WILL HAPPEN!  We are a long way from this and I don't expect we will ever get there.  This is just how it COULD happen.  Even if Cheney is impeached, he won't be shot (or hung).  He will, however, burn in hell.

by ProfRich on 02/13/2007 02:53:11 PM EST

[ Parent ]
Now if Cheney (none / 0)
got a blowjob from Valerie Plame...he would be history.

by MRFred on 02/13/2007 04:18:05 PM EST

[ Parent ]
Is it worth it? (none / 0)
Have you seen Plame?  I would totally let her give me a hummer, light years before I would get anywhere near Monica!

by ProfRich on 02/13/2007 04:22:26 PM EST

[ Parent ]
Yeah I have seen her... (none / 0)
Wilson must have some special attributes to hang on to her...and she wasnt seen on skank-o-rama like Lewinski so yeah!

by MRFred on 02/13/2007 05:10:33 PM EST

[ Parent ]
What will they get? I'll tell you they will get (none / 0)

the freaking  MEDAL OF FREEDOM!

How does one get a Medal of Freedom? Lets look a L. Paul Bremmer for example. His august and exemplary accomplishments were many but not restricted to :

 So after you do all that you get this:
 
"Jerry Bremer is a diplomat, a philanthropist, a businessman, and a fashion pioneer. (Laughter.) Everyone knows the Bremer look -- coat, dress shirt and tie, and desert combat boots. (Laughter.) Beyond the fashion statement, Jerry will be remembered for his superb work in laying the foundations of a new democracy in the Middle East.

Jerry Bremer's life of service began in 1966, when he joined the Foreign Service. He was a special assistant to six different Secretaries of State, and rose to become America's Ambassador to the Netherlands. In 1986, President Ronald Reagan appointed Jerry Ambassador-at-Large for Counterterrorism. Eventually, Speaker Hastert named him Chairman of the National Commission on Terrorism. And I chose him to serve on my Homeland Security Advisory Council.

When America and our coalition needed a seasoned diplomat and a manager to help the people of Iraq emerge from decades of oppression, I knew where to turn. For 14 months, Jerry Bremer worked day and night, in difficult, dangerous conditions, to stabilize the country, to help its people rebuild, and to establish a political process that would lead to justice and liberty. The job was demanding, requiring personal courage, calmness under fire and hundreds of decisions every day.

Yet, Jerry not only rose to the challenge, he found time nearly every day to study the Arabic language. Jerry Bremer earned the respect and admiration of Iraqis, and helped to assemble an exceptional group of Iraqi leaders for the Governing Council. With his help, these leaders drafted the Transitional Administrative Law which charted the country's political future and established a bill of rights. In the final days of hammering out consensus on this landmark law, Jerry sat through day-long meetings, sometimes without ever speaking. His silence was essential to reassure Iraqis that the new law was entirely their own. Yet his presence was essential to reassure Iraqis of our coalition's steadfast commitment to their future and their success. Every political benchmark that the Iraqis set for themselves and that Jerry helped them meet was achieved on time or ahead of schedule, including the transfer of sovereignty that ended his tenure.

Sometimes, Iraqi officials would express doubts that the day would ever come. Jerry would pick up a photo of his granddaughter and say, "This is your guarantee I'm leaving." Ladies and Gentleman L Paul Bremmer III Meadal of Fredom Recipient 

by MRFred on 02/13/2007 05:03:48 PM EST

treason (none / 0)
GREAT post MrFred..........wish I had the patience to do such in depth posting

by DudsOne2 on 02/13/2007 06:26:18 PM EST

why ask why (none / 0)
"My point is that more than one member of this administration outed a CIA agent and it seems that it was at the behest of Dick Cheney. Why hasn't Cheney been fired? Why haven't all the people who did the outing been brought up on treason charges?"
 
Several Administration officials have readily admitted to outing the identity of Valerie Plame. The reason they have not been indicted is because Valerie Plame had a desk job, and she was not classified as a covert agent on foreign assignment at the time of the disclosure.

You doubt this assertion? Then why haven't they been indicted?

You are a simpleton liberal of the lowest order.

by KenTX on 02/14/2007 06:52:53 AM EST

Wait a minute (none / 0)

I'll leave the "simpleton liberal" debate to you and your new friend. But...

The undeniable fact is that Plame was assigned to covert operations.

As I understand it Plame was eligible for reassignment when her current tour was done. CIA types rotate between field and Langely as  matter of career progression.

Just because she was not in the field at the time of te disclosure does not mean the disclosure did not compromise her previous work , contacts information and ongoing operations that resulted from it.

 

Her career postings are classified, but she was one of the elite clandestine spies -- an officer with nonofficial cover who works overseas in business or other jobs and has no diplomatic protection if detected or arrested

 

The fact she was doing "desk" work when the disclosure occurred is not  the determining factor .

If so would   Ames and the other moles who compromised years of work by former ( and active) covert agents be any less guilty?  

 

by MRFred on 02/14/2007 08:52:39 AM EST

[ Parent ]
Boo, Ken, Boo. (none / 0)

A shockingly weak argument, Ken.

Even for you.

They haven't been indicted because (a) the Republicans have had complete control for six years and (b) actual investigations and police work and legal stuf take time.  Don't you watch The Wire?  The sausage works of the criminal justice system are, like Rush Limbaugh at the Golden Corral stoned out of his mind on "Hillbilly Heroin",  slow and messy.

 

by ProfRich on 02/14/2007 09:25:34 AM EST

[ Parent ]
It's Cheney (none / 0)

The reason that they haven't been fired and indicted, I'm convinced, is because everyone in Washington is terrified of Dick Cheney. I mean, really, literally, terrified. I have little doubt that he has something on everybody int he administration, and he has something on key people outside of the administration. It's just the way people suddenly seem to change their tunes whenever Dick becomes involved in a story.

 The reason there was no true Fitzmas with Patrick Fitzgerald indicting the true source of these leaks is that Cheney has created his own little pocket of omerta, the Sicilian mafia's code of silence, around himself. Libby lied, and got himself indicted for one simple reason . . . he's less afraid of spending time in jail than whatever it is Cheney could do to him if he hadn't lied.

 This view is perfectly consistent with the activities in the Libby case this week. Why exactly is it that Libby's defense team didn't call Cheney as a defense witness?

Oh, and to say it once again, why do we listen to KenTX? He is a proven liar who supports pederasts and traitors. 

by Tergenev on 02/14/2007 11:14:20 AM EST

[ Parent ]
They are terrified for good reason (none / 0)
They are terrified for good reason, he shoots people

by Left Is Right on 02/14/2007 12:56:02 PM EST

[ Parent ]
you took the bait (none / 0)
Ken: “Several Administration officials have readily admitted to outing the identity of Valerie Plame. Then why haven't they been indicted?”

When I asked this question, I assumed it would be the end of the thread, and the end of the debate. I was surprised that anyone responded, much less attempted to perpetuate the myth of criminality. If the Libby trial ends in acquittal, and there are no more indictments, then The Left will make this story the next “Loose Change” conspiracy.

Let’s take a look at some of the attempts to explain why Pat Fitzgerald has not indicted Armitage, Rove, Libby, Fleischer, and the other administration officials who readily admit they outed the identity of Valerie Plame to the press.


Russ: “The undeniable fact is that Plame was assigned to covert operations.”

Yes, we all agree. But evidently, she was not assigned to foreign covert operations within the last five years.


Rich: “They haven't been indicted because (a) the Republicans have had complete control for six years and (b) actual investigations and police work and legal stuff take time.”
Pat Fitzgerald is a Special Prosecutor who would love to make his bones by convicting the entire administration. If he did this, he could win the presidency on the power of his reputation. He has had nearly four years to investigate and make a case, and the only thing he can come up with is a weak process indictment of Scooter’s memory?


Tergenev: “The reason that they haven't been fired and indicted, I'm convinced, is because everyone in Washington is terrified of Dick Cheney. I mean, really, literally, terrified.”
Another Loose Change Nut Job on the loose. Are you one of the Russians who is working to bring back the days of global communist domination?

by KenTX on 02/15/2007 12:44:08 AM EST

[ Parent ]
Libby is just an indicator (none / 0)
Its great watching the Libby tria,l it shows the American people just exactly how the Bush administration works. Its just another nail in their neo facist coffin.


by Left Is Right on 02/15/2007 08:55:28 AM EST

[ Parent ]
Weasel language and Conworld (none / 0)
I find it amusing that the Cons scream and foam at the mouth when condemning Clinton for using weasel language to deny he lied about a blow job, yet they are masters at excusing the Shrub administration when it comes to compromising the National security to protect Big Dick and Fearless Leader, by using weasel language.

First we must remember it wasn’t the Democrats, it wasn’t the Liberal media, it wasn’t any of the people who “hate America” who protested the outing of Valerie Plame. It was the CIA who filed the complaint with the Justice Department.

What was the complaint? Someone had outed a COVERT OPERATIVE. So now we must assume that The Central Intelligence Agency is so incompetent that they don’t know what constitutes a covert operative in their own agency.

In Conworld the argument goes like this:

CIA says “She is a covert operative”

Conworld  “NO SHE’S NOT”

CIA “Yes she is”

Conworld “NOOOOO SHE’S NOT AND THAT’S THAT”.

Not really the most elegant argument in the world but it’s how the Cons view the world. Just repeat something often enough and loud enough and it makes it true.

Next we must assume that because she was working at a desk in Washington instead of oversees that that means she wasn’t covert.(Weasel Language at it’s finest)

 It would be similar to outing an undercover narcotics police officer who had spent years developing leads and informants because he had completed a operation and was currently working at the station doing the paperwork to bring the operation together to prosecute the cases against the drug dealers.

Well the Con argument is that he isn’t undercover if he is working at a desk, and all the informants and other undercover officers that are jeopardized in the process….Well doesn’t really matter does it. If a major shipment of heroin or cocaine is lost as well as millions of dollars of illegal drug money is lost from seizure to bad, nothing wrong with that, after all HE WASN’T CURRENTLY UNDERCOVER.

Unfortunately with Ms. Plames outing it wasn’t compromising a narcotics investigation, it was compromising investigation into WMD’s. Outing not only Ms. Plame but the cover company the CIA used and potentially putting at risk the lives of anyone who had contact with Ms. Plame or the front company she used as a covert operative.  It is unknown what damage has been done by these vile loathsome individuals who value political revenge over National Security, but when eventually a WMD is used against us I wonder if they will take a moment to question whether if they hadn’t compromised what the CIA considered an ongoing operation, that perhaps it could have been uncovered and stopped from being deployed. Nah they’ll just blame the Dems, the Liberal media, or anyone they can, but like Shrub they never take responsibility for their actions.

As to why no indictment? We all no the language of the law is vague and very difficult to prove, but just because you can’t bring charges does not make what these people did right, moral, or justified. They compromised, according to the CIA, our National Security and all we get from the Cons is “Yeah but you can’t prove it was illegal”.

I’m so glad these people brought integrity and honor back to the White House.

"Although it is not true that all conservatives are stupid people, it is true that most stupid people are conservative." John Stuart Mill

by Hubble on 02/15/2007 11:17:33 AM EST

[ Parent ]
Let Us Not Forget (none / 0)

As we contemplate the potential damage the Plame outing might have done and might do in the future to our efforts to defend our nation we should also recall the inarguable damage these people have already done to our national security.

In the late 1990s a madman was organizing a group of individuals in a plot to strike at the very heart of our country and its security.  What were our intelligence agents doing?  Working round the clock to foil these evil men?  No.

Dozens of these public protectors were digging through Bill Clinton's dirty laundry in a futile attempt to get the Greatest President of Our Lifetime  out of office.  In retrospect, this kinda seems like misplaced priorities, huh?

Luckily most of us are wide awake in America now and see that all thier chest beating about national security is really about two things.  Covering thier own war profiteering and justifying thier incredibly petty attacks on anyone they have on thier Nixon style enemies list.

Remember the words of America's greatest poet:

"Patriotism is the last refuge to which a scoundrel clings.

Steal a little and they throw you in jail, steal a lot and they make you king"

Sweetheart Like You

Bob Dylan 

by ProfRich on 02/15/2007 12:01:25 PM EST

[ Parent ]
See Eye Eh (none / 0)
First we must remember it wasn't the Democrats, it wasn't the Liberal media, it wasn't any of the people who "hate America" who protested the outing of Valerie Plame. It was the CIA who filed the complaint with the Justice Department.

The CIA is no less politicized than the others you listed. It is not a neutral actor in the circus we call government.

by Twba on 02/15/2007 03:59:03 PM EST

[ Parent ]
Marshall McLuhan Moment (none / 0)
Here’s an interesting article from Victoria Toensing, the lady who helped write the Intelligence Identities Protection Act. That is the law that liberals are claiming administration officials violated.

She says that no laws were broken, because Valerie Plame did not meet the criteria of being a covert agent who had been on assignment abroad within the last five years.

This explains why Fitzgerald hasn’t indicted any of the numerous people who have openly admitted to outing the identity of Valerie Plame.

If the Libby trial comes back with acquittal, conservatives will be able to bang the drum loudly until November 2008.

by KenTX on 02/15/2007 06:12:49 PM EST

[ Parent ]
Until November 2008 (none / 0)
When they will get thier asses handed to them (again) in an election.

by ProfRich on 02/16/2007 12:24:44 AM EST

[ Parent ]
Fired and/or treason | 20 comments (20 topical, 0 hidden)
 Display: