The Racially Motivated Endorsement Thing

Okay, this is sort of a rant, but I am really sort of astounded that people are discounting Colin Powell's endorsement solely because both he and Obama are black.

I want to address this again because of bobo's argument about race playing a factor in Colin Powell's endorsement.  Not calling you out bobo--I just want to try to explain my side of this argument better.

I agree with bobo that race may come into mind when endorsing someone, but what I am trying to argue is that it DOES NOT NECESSARILY INFLUENCE ONE'S ACTUAL BEHAVIOR.  Every time we make an important decision, we take into consideration many, many factors, but our behavior is not necessarily influenced by all of those factors.  So, while Powell surely is happy that his favored candidate is black, I think it could have actually made him MORE reluctant to make an endorsement of Obama, for fear that his endorsement would be belittled by people saying it was merely racially based (just like is happening).

If race is such an important factor, how do you account for things like the Chicago Tribune endorsing Obama, after 161 years of endorsing Republicans?  Chris Buckley?  How do you account for the phenomenal support of Obama by white women?  Are we voting with our vaginas because black men have bigger penises?  Or do we see Obama as being a kinder person more likely to take care of Americans instead of just rich people?  Is it more likely that Colin Powell supports Obama because of his intelligence or his skin color?  Following right-wing logic, if Obama was an idiot like Palin, or a flip-flopper like McCain, Powell would still have endorsed Obama. Instead, he first supported McCain and gave the maximum donation he could to the campaign.  I don't see people accusing Lieberman of supporting McCain because of skin color.  Why not?  Because it is such a ridiculous argument to thinking people, whether or not Lieberman is a total racist clown (I don't think he is--he's just a right-wing conservative now).  If anything, Lieberman is voting his religion, which is probably more of a factor for many people than race or sex.

How can we discount sex as a factor in endorsements?  Like race, it is impossible to eliminate as a a possible factor.  McCain counted on getting female votes by selecting Palin as his running mate.  But since she is an idiot, the ploy doesn't work except among other idiots, which pretty much shatters the idea that females will endorse any female just because she is a woman.  How is race any different?  

If you are an intelligent and educated person, thoughts of supporting someone because of their race or sex seem somewhat ridiculous.  That is why I discount it as a factor for Powell's endorsement. Whatever you may think of Powell, he is not a shallow or superficial person.

Does this make sense?  It seems to me that intelligent people separate their biases from their behavior.  That is how I was raised.  When I lived in a black neighborhood in Oakland, I had some very negative experiences with blacks, but that didn't make me a racist because I could separate socio-economic issues from skin color.  My company has people from all over the world, and I see no evidence of people of one race supporting others because of skin color. But perhaps the scientific community is a bit more colorblind than your average plumber from Ohiowa or Minneconsigan.  I'm sure Colin Powell is as intelligent as the scientists in my company.

I believe that Colin Powell is smart enough to be able to separate any racial bias from a reasoned opinion.  He hardly seems to be a racist to me.  Why shouldn't he be proud that an African-American might be president?  I certainly am, but I am white.  If Obama was some sort of douchebag, he would not have endorsed him; do you agree?  If you agree with that statement, then the Limbaugh/Buchanan hypothesis is incorrect--race did not matter enough to influence his behavior.

In my humble opinion, Powell endorsed Obama because the Republican ticket is too far to the right for him to feel comfortable with it.  People say that the average American is "center-right."  This is why conservatives are rejecting McCain/Palin.  They don't feel that they represent the views of the average conservative.

< Open Thread - Manifesting President Obama | Blogs vs. Discussion forum and web site layout >
 Display:
Powell's endorsement interview on MTP this sunday and drew the conclusion that Powell was motivated by race to endorse Obama is a complete moron. The conservatives are currently going out of their way to expose themselves as such. Powell laid out a detailed case for Obama and against the McCain-Palin ticket. He was asked about race and addressed it. It was not an over-riding or even strongly contributing factor.

by hazmat on 10/20/2008 06:00:22 PM EST

nothing more on the subject need be said.

I Tivoed Meet The Press so I could watch Powell .. I watched his answer 3 times. ( I wanted to revel in it heh)

boob1 is parroting Rush Limbaugh ..who of course is a racist too

Limbaughs logic would follow that he is endorsing McCain because he is white.


by Chinese Democracy on 10/20/2008 06:19:58 PM EST

[ Parent ]
He is a full on racist. No amount of typing is going to change that.

This is the level he is at

"My plan was to call you a Hippie Fag Liberal Elitist Snob Asshole who thinks they know everything and can tell others how to think and how to feel..."

Ill gladly call him out any time and every time. He  is the antitheses of everything I believe in.


by Chinese Democracy on 10/20/2008 06:24:13 PM EST

I know he and Ken and Tuba just parrot whatever Limbaugh is saying, but I couldn't keep myself from ranting once I saw Pat Buchanan say it.  I know he's a right-wing asshole, but I still expected better of him.

~proud to be a hippie fag-loving liberal elitist snob~

 

by desertpear on 10/20/2008 06:27:18 PM EST

[ Parent ]
of course

I was just warning you.. don't expect logic and sound reasoning and a little heart  to change his mind.

I also liked haz...  if you watched Powell you would know its not race..  thats pretty much how I see it.

I fly my hippy fag liberal flag proudly as well

The righties are hanging around on a liberal leaning blog to stir shit..and Im up for the challenge .


by Chinese Democracy on 10/20/2008 06:32:17 PM EST

[ Parent ]

I was pissed off at Powell.  That crap he told the U.N., the hot air he spewed both before and after the invasion.  And even when he knew something was wrong, he didn't fight as hard as he could for what he knew to be right.  He backed down "like a good soldier".  And just this month he stood up as a character witness for Ted Stevens at Stevens' corruption trial.  I thought, "there's dirt in this guy's character that no one suspects."

So when he endorsed Obama, I thought the Republicans would have an easy time burying Powell.  The hard right wingers never really liked him anyway.  And since Stevens was going down anyway, they could throw him to the wolves and use him to bury Powell by saying, "Oh, Powell likes Obama?  Well he also likes that crook Stevens".

But I met a woman yesterday who decided to vote for Obama because of Powell's endorsement.  Normally, I don't think much of people who have that kind of epiphany, but meeting her was a revelation.  Most of the people I know are wonks of one sort or another and keep up with current events.  Many of the people I know are Republicans, and their prejudices are clear whenever we speak, but they know their positions on the issues.  And the Democrats I know, while generally better informed than the Republicans, also have no doubts.

But this woman was just your average grandmother, mystified by many of the changes in the world during her lifetime, but also unaffected by many of them.  She simply has no need for a computer.  She hasn't needed to know about the anti-missile system being installed in Poland because it has had nothing to do with the children and household which have consumed her existence.

So when she was torn deciding for whom she would vote, I understood why when she told me.  She didn't have as much information as I did, and (realistically) I couldn't expect her to -- because I spend 'way too much time on this stuff.

But Powell answered her questions, and she had no doubt that she would vote for Obama tomorrow when the library's early voting booth opens.  It may be that she never wanted to vote for McCain but would have only because he was an older white man and, in her experience, older white men were more reliable that younger black men, but she trusted Powell beyond doubt.  And when Powell said that Obama was okay, that was enough for her.

I know for certain that Powell got at least one vote for Obama.  That's good enough for me.

Thank you, General.  I'm grateful for your service.

by EveningStarNM on 10/20/2008 07:34:58 PM EST

Sometimes we have to remember that he isn't trying to change the opinions of libs or right wingers, but the moderate conservatives and Democrats that still respect him.

I was really angry at him for the UN presentation too, but I'm also willing to give people a second chance if I think they warrant it.  After all, I rarely agree with anyone's beliefs or behavior 100% of the time.

by desertpear on 10/20/2008 08:02:14 PM EST

[ Parent ]
"It's tempting to look at Powell's incredibly high approval ratings -- 80% of Americans have a favorable view of Powell  -- and conclude that Powell's endorsement could sway the entire nation. But the same poll indicates that just 5% felt Powell's endorsement would be very likely to influence their vote. When you consider that that less than 10% of the public remains undecided, however, that 5% looms much larger."

by desertpear on 10/20/2008 08:07:51 PM EST

[ Parent ]
If he moves 1% of the vote from undecided to Obama he will have dealt a fatal blow to McPalin.  Obama is at just over 50 now.  51% and its ballgame.

by ProfRich on 10/20/2008 10:54:04 PM EST

[ Parent ]

Obama is at 0% right now (well, almost. Techically he's <1%).

by EveningStarNM on 10/20/2008 10:56:34 PM EST

[ Parent ]

He's Lou Holtz.

No matter how much of a cakewalk Holtz's teams had on Saturday, Lou insisted the other guys were the 1972 Dolphins.  He took this shtick to comic lengths doing things like telling the media his Nat Champ 88 Notre Dame team was in for the fight of their life against Navy and the like.

I see what you are doing, ES,NM and I am down with ya.

by ProfRich on 10/20/2008 11:17:28 PM EST

[ Parent ]

I also experience the post-racial workplace where all people coexist peacefully.  We all help each other learn and grow, even though we are brought together b/c we are scientists, still we become better citizens and people by being in an accepting and welcoming social environment.

And this includes people from all walks of life: christians (casual and fervent), liberals, conservatives (albeit not many), muslims, jews, hindus, agnostics, atheists, buddhists, many races (white, black, asian, latino, middle eastern).... who represent many places around the world such as puerto rico, chile, argentina, germany, china, turkey, and iran.

It's like my happy little utopia which gives me hope that one day this microcosm of peace and happiness amongst world cultures can be applied and work worldwide.

So...agreed, the scientific community is very inclusive and tolerant.  :)

Btw pear, what field do you do your work in?  I assume you're at a biotech company...

 

 

Nothing in life is to be feared. It is only to be understood.
~Dr. Marie Curie

by DocZee on 10/20/2008 09:26:11 PM EST

That is where the company I work for is located, and you are right, it is like a little social utopia.  I don't think there are any conservatives though.

Environmental consulting actually, but a company that works closely with academics and focuses on state-of-the-art science rather than pandering to clients. 

 

by desertpear on 10/20/2008 09:50:42 PM EST

[ Parent ]
I'm on the opposite coast in massachusetts in academia, well technically at a hospital campus a little outside boston.  I envy the bay area's workplace environment though...great skyline!

by DocZee on 10/20/2008 10:05:18 PM EST

[ Parent ]
But worked at the HQ in Berkeley for many years.  Now I can only visit.

by desertpear on 10/20/2008 10:30:44 PM EST

[ Parent ]
I just had an epiphany. One of the big reasons why I'm a progressive is probably b/c of my work environment.  Seems that progressive ways of living work to bring people together and coexist rather well.

by DocZee on 10/21/2008 09:16:54 AM EST

[ Parent ]
I actually had to go back to work yesterday, and they actually wanted me to do something (go figure).

I dont know what I can say to make this make sense to you - As I have stated in like 4 different posts now, Yes its a good thing that General Powell endorsed Obama, yes there are a plethora of reasons for him to do so and race wasnt the ONLY factor. But to say that race wasnt a factor at all is blatantly stupid and really naive...

If General Powell really had the nations interest in heart before his own, then perhaps he shouldnt have associated himself with the Bushies and lied through his teeth to the American people and the UN and over his illustrious career fueled by Republican promotion.

I think it makes more sense to think that Powell does not want to be observed as an "Uncle Tom" by sticking with the Old White guy in this cycle. He does not want to be perceived as the next Clarence Thomas...

You seem to think that Powell came to this conclusion with honesty and love for his country. I think he read the writing on the wall and didnt want to look like a boob.

I dont know how to make this any clearer - I think Obama has played this brilliantly - the "Socialist Redistributor of Wealth" story was catching on to independents, and he found a way to deflect it through Powell - and now all of the sudden his poor grandmother is "gravely ill" - I hope she is OK, her and her impeccable timing...

Sheesh!

:)

by bobo1 on 10/21/2008 09:48:21 AM EST

[ Parent ]
"...and now all of the sudden his poor grandmother is "gravely ill" - I hope she is OK, her and her impeccable timing..."

His grandmother is dying.  Have a heart, would ya?

by desertpear on 10/21/2008 03:58:35 PM EST

[ Parent ]
He probably poisoned her because he wanted a few days off.  Can you prove that it didn't happen?

by Spencer on 10/21/2008 04:25:10 PM EST

[ Parent ]
I thought that already happened, but either way, a broken hip can sort of be a last straw when you are an elderly woman.  Osteoporosis is nasty.

"The death rate for hip fracture patients is higher than for other people of the same age who do not sustain the injury. About 24 percent of hip fracture patients over age 50 die within 12 months after injury because of complications related to the injury and the extended recovery period."

 

by desertpear on 10/21/2008 06:01:03 PM EST

[ Parent ]

Barack Obama's grandmother raised him.  They are very close, and she may be gravely ill.

How is your mother doing, by the way?

by EveningStarNM on 10/21/2008 04:10:40 PM EST

[ Parent ]
any of various economic and political theories advocating collective or governmental ownership and administration of the means of production and distribution of goods

Did you understand that BoboTX?  the GOVERMENT owns the companies.

Show me where Obama advocates that?

Is bush a socialist?

According to the right wing definition of socialism  medicare/medicaid and social security  would already make this a socialist country right?

What wealth is Obama "redistributing" and how.. ?

Its going to be hard for you because the comedian Rush Limbaugh doesnt really explain anything.

:)


by Chinese Democracy on 10/21/2008 05:37:12 PM EST

[ Parent ]
as they crash and burn, I doubt anyone except die hard republican rednecks are falling for this.
I guess it offers them some comfort in their time of anger and defeat.

Why don't the republicans who parrot this rubbish simply show examples in Powells past which back this up?
Surely somone turning against the GOP in such a way would have shown some previous bias, surely, cmon republicans, show us how you are right, you wouldn't just make this stuff up would you?

by Maverick on 10/21/2008 05:40:00 AM EST

Not many ARE falling for the rovian smear and fear tactics.. The net pretty much killed it as information and fact checking are instantly availble 24/7..

Here is how much the public at large are falling for McCains  utter bull shit .

    Barack Obama's lead over John McCain has steadily increased since mid-September, when the race was essentially even. Shortly after the first presidential debate on Sept. 26, Obama moved to a 49% to 42% lead; that margin inched up to 50% to 40% in a poll taken just after the second debate. Currently, Obama enjoys his widest margin yet over McCain among registered voters, at 52% to 38%. When the sample of voters is narrowed to those most likely to vote, Obama leads by 53% to 39%.

Pew Oct 16-19, MoE +/- 2.5

Obama   52 (50)
McCain  38 (40)


by Chinese Democracy on 10/21/2008 05:40:39 PM EST

[ Parent ]
 Display: