10/24/2008 04:26:30 PM EST

Extinction, Climate Change, and Deep Time

posted by desertpear

OK, this was originally a response to Gatekeeper's post, but I decided to blog it out in case anyone is interested, or just tired of campaign news.

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This is such a difficult and complex topic in many respects that I hesitate to ever discuss it in a political forum.  There will be mass extinction in our lives and I don't believe that is going to change considering the capitalist systems that are currently in place.  Most people can't grasp that extinction is not just losing individual species, but that loss of species has cascading effects on the ecosystems that they live in, which in turn affect the ecosystem services that humans depend on to provide clean water, air, soil, etc.  

It can be very depressing, so, if you want to accept it gracefully, or just be able to sleep at night knowing your species is so fucked, you have to look at it from a different point of view.  The "deep time" view.  Extinctions have happened before, destroying entire ecosystems of marvelous and beautiful creatures that were around for millions of years (99.9% of all species according to one site).  It's just that we weren't around to get depressed about it.  Although subjectively, I hate the idea of ANY species going extinct, and I bemoan the destruction of any habitat, you have to realize that those animals are not bemoaning their fate or crying about their habitat being destroyed.  They are just living and dying in their own subjective worlds.  So, it's mainly a problem of accepting that we just happened to be born at a time when our species is inexorably causing a mass extinction to occur and that our quality of life is going to change dramatically.  However, evolution is change.  Humans won't be around forever.  Over millions of years, new forms of life will evolve from those that are left, just as the huge diversity of mammals evolved from some little ratlike critter, and birds from some crazy dinosaur with feathers.  I really would have loved to see those mastodons and giant ground sloths too.

I have extreme sensitivity and empathy for animals, and the natural world is the source of happiness for me personally, so I have spent a lot of time thinking about this and talking with other ecologists about it.  I don't think we can do a lot to stop it from happening.  It would require near-immediate and global changes in the way we live and human disturbance to habitats is happening at too rapid of a pace to save many species that have narrow habitat requirements or specialized life histories.  This is why I have to sometimes take a longer view while still "fighting the good fight" to save whatever we can.  But, even then, evolution happens, things change, and geologic time never stops, even for us self-centered naked apes.

Here is an illustration to give some perspective.  Humans probably don't show up at this scale. 


 

Another way to think of deep time.  Stretch your arms out.  This represents the entire history of Earth.  If you stroked a nail file along the tip of your right-hand middle fingernail, you would eliminate the part of history occupied by humans.

Links if you are interested:

Extinction discussion from PBS

Great article from Harper's on bolides and how Earth and evolution may be largely shaped by catastrophic events.

Geologic Time

Geologic Time Scale

Wonderful illustrations of past life forms and evolution

A great science blog on tetrapod zoology and evolution if you really want to nerd out.

< Official McCain taking L's | Open Thread >

Poll

Are you still depressed about the 6th extinction?
I never cared anyway 14%
I'm still depressed 71%
I'll think about it 14%
This helped a little 0%
Obama will end the great extinction 0%
I don't believe in geological time; God made it all in 6 days and then created beer 0%

Votes: 7
Results | Other Polls
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Extinction, Climate Change, and Deep Time | 6 comments (6 topical, 0 hidden)
I'm still depressed (none / 0)

I grew up with the idea that one of the great things about our country was our sense of responsibility and duty.  My father was a career officer in the Air Force, and to grow up on Air Force bases is to be thoroughly marinated in a sense of duty and country, service and community.  The purpose of this duty and community was to protect freedom and democracy, and to pass a better world onto future generations.

Does that sound over-dramatic?  When I look at those words, a summation of some of my childhood learning in compact form, I have to admit that it does.  Except that it's true.

So now we are beginning to observe and experience, sometimes in very personal terms, the results of abandoning those principles in the search for short-term profits.  The world we are passing on to our descendents is NOT better, it is much worse.  Our children and their children and their children and... will have difficult lives because of our generation's irresponsibility and short-sightedness.  I'm very sad about that.

But what really pisses me off is that I knew that what we were doing was wrong, but I didn't do enough to stop it.

After I help to get Barack Obama elected, I need to find another way to help with Change.  I have no idea where, but I can't go on the way I was, hoping for the best while merely witnessing the worst.

by EveningStarNM on 10/24/2008 10:45:53 PM EST

don't get me wrong (none / 0)

I hope we can turn some things around and I will still fight for change too, same as I ever have.  I just feel pretty pessimistic about the large-scale changes we would need to make SOON to avoid this extinction event. And yeah, I'm often depressed about it too, despite this post.

by desertpear on 10/24/2008 11:08:22 PM EST

[ Parent ]
Yeah. I kinda figured that. (none / 0)

So, looking at it long-term, our great-great-great grandchildren will never have known a better world, and they won't be sad that their planet is in such bad shape because they'll more easily be able to accept it as just the way things are.  Maybe they'll even begin to see some improvements if their grandparents and great-grandparents and great-great grandparents were able to do what we haven't.  Maybe they won't look back with disgust on the generation that came after "The Greatest Generation" as "The Selfish Generation".

The only times when I haven't felt tremendous anger and disgust with Republicans the last few weeks has been when I've been working for Obama.  I guess I should probably take more time off from work to help with the campaign.

by EveningStarNM on 10/24/2008 11:55:37 PM EST

[ Parent ]
I think getting Barack in the White House (none / 0)

is a huge deal.  I know he isn't any sort of progressive dream, but I do think there is a chance for him to do a lot of good.  We need an inspiring leader. 

The factor that I don't believe anyone is wiling to address is overpopulation, and despite the apparent "space," we just can't go on reproducing like we are.  But people want to have kids.  I never have, but I'm a misfit in this society.

Like my good friend says:  "Be ever hopeful, yet wise."

I voted tonight on my mail-in ballot and it felt really good. 

by desertpear on 10/25/2008 01:05:43 AM EST

[ Parent ]
overpopulation or overconsumption? (none / 0)
I don't think overpopulation is as big an issue, at least in developed countries like the U.S.  I think overconsumption is much more of an issue - the idea that one is entitled to the lifestyle one's parents gave them growing up and then some.  The American Dream without a sense of American Responsibility.

I've been driving around Colorado to parts of "real America" as Sarah Palin calls it, just to get a sense for the economies and motivations that drive it.  There's oil and gas - that's huge.  There's cheap food and booze: high fructose corn syrup, GMO-based food, etc. - which Monsanto has a lock on, and they're arguably hurting global ecosystems more than the oil/gas companies.  I also deliver paint to job sites as part of my job, and up until last year, there was TONS of new construction all around Colorado, where the biggest houses were being produced as cheaply as possible, and that's not good for local ecosystems either.

And that's only taking what people consider to be bare necessities (a good home, cheap food, cheap gas).

I also think that getting Obama into the White House would be a huge step forward.  It'd legitimize a culture of political engagement, community organization, and conscious living.  Hopefully that culture could hold its own against the pervading one of conspicuous consumption, unhealthy habits, and environmental apathy. 

I don't know if it would be an immediate 180-degree shift toward the side of good - I honestly don't know how much can be done to stem the tide of environmental hardship the human race has wreaked upon the earth for the past hundred years - the negative habits ingrained in businesses and individuals.  Things have gotten so bad, and boil seems to be ripe to burst, no matter who gets elected.  I think the Obama/Biden team would deal with it far more wisely than the Palin/McCain team.  I switch their names because I think Palin would have far more power in the administration than McCain, because she's so ambitious and he's so old and has seemed uneasy about his campaign, which I attribute either to senility or the rumblings of some sliver of conscience he still has left, without the youthful vitality and courage he once had to act on it.

by marlonm on 10/25/2008 12:19:13 PM EST

[ Parent ]
I'd say both (none / 0)

In general, people who are intent on having kids like to argue that overpopulation is not a problem, but it is.  If people could restrict themselves to one or two kids, that is great.  But now Ken will come in and say that is an awesome thing--for progressives to reduce their population while conservative evangelicals pop out entire litters. 

A large part of our population has no interest in reducing consumption or population because they see no direct connection with their quality of life.  Until that awareness is raised, through education of the young, disasters whose magnitude is increased because of habitat destruction (e.g., Katrina), or just increasing effects of climate change, pollution, etc., they won't be convinced that it is worthwhile.  Already though, kids are often the most aware about the problems and teach their parents.  There is some hope.   And I do think things will improve with Obama in charge.  People like Palin would cause great damage, as they put people and profits above everything, with no apparent vision for the long-term future.  It's just continuing horrible practices that funnel money to corporations and reduce quality of life for all.  Thankfully, not all "Christians" are like her.  She just seems nuts to me.

Consumption is a huge issue.  Our entire society and economy is dependent on quantity rather than quality.  If we reduce consumption, that means working less and having more free time.  Material things do not necessarily make us happy, but it sure makes corporations happy.

Over the long term, we better start terraforming Mars and warming up Titan.  

by desertpear on 10/25/2008 12:37:09 PM EST

[ Parent ]
Extinction, Climate Change, and Deep Time | 6 comments (6 topical, 0 hidden)
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