Fighting Effectively Against Dirty Rovian Tactics

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Senator Clinton has started down the path of fighting dirty against Senator Obama in the race for the Democratic presidential nomination.  It's important to understand that combatting this mentally unhealthy behavior can be done in a fair, effective and mentally healthy way.

From a commenter on another blog:
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Sorry but politics is how things get done in Wash DC. To stop playing politics, you would also have to replace the entire House and Senate with those who don't play politics.
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I suspect that manipulation, a form of emotional abuse, is being minimized and falsely framed as "politics." Politics is about fighting for your ideas, but there is a distinction between fighting fairly and fighting dirty.  A candidate can fight fairly by ethically reframing an issue, pivoting and using verbal jujitsu to redirect the attack back upon the source.  Fighting fairly is about reframing the voters' perception of reality toward the truth.  Fighting dirty, like Karl Rove, is about distorting and deluding voters' perception of reality away from truth. Fighting dirty is mentally unhealthy behavior.  When a person fights dirty, it immediately signals they are aggressing from a position of weakness, because their own ideas don't stand up to scrutiny.
 
There are numerous manipulation tactics to be aware of such as lying (including by omission), denial, minimization, selective inattention, rationalization, diversion, evasion, covert intimidation, guilt-tripping, toxic shaming, playing the victim role, vilifying the victim, playing the servant role, seduction (charm offensive), projecting the blame, feigning innocence, feigning confusion, and brandishing anger (false outrage).  To learn about these tactics in depth, you can order a book on Amazon called "In Sheep's Clothing: Understanding and Dealing With Manipulative People" by Dr. George K. Simon. 
 
As Dr. Simon states:
“Fighting openly and fairly for our legitimate needs is often necessary and constructive.  When we fight for what we truly need, while respecting the rights and needs of others and taking care not to needlessly injure them, our behavior is best labeled assertive. Assertive behavior is one of the most healthy human behaviors.”
 
It's not necessary nor mentally healthy to sink to Karl Rove's level in order to effectively beat dirty fighting techniques.  The way to combat the dirty fighting techniques of an aggressor is to shine a bright spotlight on their manipulation tactics, which ends up revealing their weakness of character for using them in the first place.
 
Senator Clinton's quote:
"I think that I have a lifetime of experience that I will bring to the White House. Sen. John McCain has a lifetime of experience that he’d bring to the White House. And Sen. Obama has a speech he gave in 2002.”
 
Toxic Shaming
Senator Clinton's quote above is an example of the shaming manipulation tactic because Senator Clinton is inviting Senator Obama to feel ashamed for seeking the Democratic Party presidential nomination as she puts down his lifetime of experience.  Senator Clinton also uses the shaming manipulation tactic as a way to increase fear and doubt in voters about Senator Obama’s experience. 
 
Aggressing from a position of weakness, Senator Clinton uses the shaming manipulation tactic to distort and delude American voters away from the truth of Senator Obama’s lifetime of experience as a public servant.
 
As Dr. Simon points out, “Covert-aggressives use this tactic to make others feel inadequate or unworthy, and therefore, submit to them. It's an effective way to foster a continued sense of personal inadequacy in the weaker party, thereby allowing an aggressor to maintain a position of dominance.”  Senator Clinton is attempting to foster a sense of personal inadequacy in Senator Obama so that he submits to her, or as Roseanne Barr puts it, "Bow to the Woman."

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I appreciate that someone recognizes what Obama needs to do in order to not be shamed or labeled as a whiny little democrat...

This "taking the high road" approach is synonymous with "Im not gonna fight the bully cause fighting is wrong..."

Somebody needs to put the bitch in her place, and if Obama is the one to do it, so be it...

Assertiveness is a good thing, but to tame the shrew that is Hillary, hes gonna need to knock her on her ass, publicly with no regrets and no shame...then he needs to do the same with Grandpa Death...

Do you think he has it in him, fightthefacism?

by bobo1 on 03/08/2008 12:57:23 PM EST


You mean fight? That is so wrong, so immoral so GOD DAMN RIGHT!


by LORD FOUL on 03/08/2008 01:19:44 PM EST

[ Parent ]
A huge part of Obama's inspiring (inspiring as evidenced by the ENORMOUS voter turnout and buzz for Obama specifically) message relates to him fighting for change, but NOT fighting dirty.

He'll jab, get you with the body blow and finish you with the uppercut like any good fighter. What he *won't* do is hit you below the belt with his glue-soaked glove he rolled in broken glass before the fight. Or if you prefer, he won't (as Hillary seems willing to do) bite of your God damn ear in an act of desperation that only works short term but makes you a disgusting joke to most people long term.

The former will work just fine while the latter has (and or *will*) anger and turn off a lot of people.

by ihavenobias on 03/08/2008 01:32:43 PM EST

[ Parent ]

"Assertiveness is a good thing, but to tame the shrew that is Hillary, hes gonna need to knock her on her ass, publicly with no regrets and no shame...then he needs to do the same with Grandpa Death..."

So what is that you are suggesting he do to "...knock her on her ass, publicly......"? 

by Tom Paine Jr on 03/09/2008 04:56:01 PM EST

[ Parent ]
No doubt the monster (Hillary) has a maniacle race bating plan to defeat Obama! She is pure evil and every action has to be analyzed for its hidden darker meaning.

by acroso on 03/08/2008 02:04:26 PM EST


When the Obamabots and Acrosomaniac are in agreement about The Hildabeast.

Why am I uncomfortable with that?

by Hubble on 03/08/2008 07:27:41 PM EST

[ Parent ]
Gee I dunno  you filled your adult diaper?

by Chinese Democracy on 03/08/2008 08:51:56 PM EST

[ Parent ]
Tiny made a funny.

Hey everybody it's an adult diaper joke. (You know me being OLD and all that) That was a hoot. Gosh ya got me good with that one. MAN OH MAN, I have been served. Really everyone see what a wit our Tiny is. Just zinger after zinger.

Yep, you sure taught me a lesson I want soon forget. With wit like that it's a wonder anyone ever disagrees with you.

Just one question Tiny, are you talking from experience? All stretched out, no control and full of shit, sort of like your comments? I've heard that sometimes happens.

by Hubble on 03/08/2008 09:09:17 PM EST

[ Parent ]
"All stretched out, no control" 

Sorry Hubble, but I'm throwing a penalty flag.

It's perfectly OK to bash a person's age by claiming they wear Attends adult diapers.

It's perfectly OK to bash a person's Southern Heritage, by calling them an ignorant, trailer trash, redneck.

It's perfectly OK to bash a person's lack of skin pigmentation, by calling them a racist bigot.

It's perfectly OK to bash a person's gender by calling them a misogynistic chauvinistic pig.

It's perfectly OK to bash a person's religion by calling them a born-again Baptist Nut.

It's perfectly OK to bash a person's patriotic belief in a strong, safe America by calling them a war-monger.

In fact, it's perfectly OK to say anything you please about a white, male, middle-class, middle-aged, evangelical, heterosexual, patriotic American.

But I don't want to hear anymore jokes outta you about people who openly promote gay lifestyle and the gay agenda. You got that Mister?

Oh yeah. One more thing. Welcome to the Republican Party.

by KenTX on 03/08/2008 09:54:27 PM EST

[ Parent ]
Its perfectly ok for you to try to justify something that is abhorrent. It just proves what you are.

Homosexuality isnt shameful

Hiding the fact that you are Homosexual is

Hello from the world outside of redneck backwards ass Texas :)

by Chinese Democracy on 03/09/2008 08:54:38 AM EST

[ Parent ]
That should prove that I'm down with the struggle.

by KenTX on 03/09/2008 09:15:13 AM EST

[ Parent ]
While I'm sure Tiny will agree 101% with you that I was being a Red Neck, "Dork", it only goes to show you that sometimes you read more into it than is there.

The most common cause of bowel incontinence, ironically, is constipation. Constipation causes the muscles of the anus and intestines to stretch and weaken (the anus is the opening through which stool leaves the body). The weakened muscles will prevent the rectum from closing tightly, thus resulting in leakage of stool (the rectum connects to the anus). Weakened intestinal muscles will also slow down the bowels, making it difficult to pass stools and further worsening the constipation.

The question you have to ask is there a more uptight, constipated member of the forum than our own Tiny?

Now Tiny gets to froth and scream that he knows what I really meant, and he'll have to be in agreement with Ken to do it. The stress could bring on another bout of constipation and that's not good for his condition.

by Hubble on 03/08/2008 10:23:05 PM EST

[ Parent ]
You are the one that seems to be carrying on... and on... and on... and on..

Uptight isnt the word I would use to describe you. But Ill go with with it.

Yea I did get you good didnt I.

by Chinese Democracy on 03/09/2008 08:57:33 AM EST

[ Parent ]
I feel so gotten.
Golly how do you do it. The sparkling wit, the well placed barb that is always on target. It must be a gift.
Wow look at those put downs.
Redneck
Dork
Diapers
Old
The list goes on and on.

Yes we all feel so awed when you turn your special gifts on us and prove what a mature, articulate, intelligent, superior human being you are. In fact I'm guessing you think that there "AIN'T" nobody smarter than YOU!!!!

by Hubble on 03/09/2008 05:23:53 PM EST

[ Parent ]
Let the replay booth review the play and see if the sideline judge made the right call or if there is sufficient evidence to overturn the ruling on the field.

by Hubble on 03/08/2008 10:32:07 PM EST

[ Parent ]

Chinese Checkers has a thing about older people. He has made derogatory comments about age several times.

Now if you'll excuse me I must toddle off to Sams Club...I hear that have a special on Depends. I need to get ther before the Rainbow Warriors buy them out.



by MRFred on 03/09/2008 10:07:28 AM EST

[ Parent ]
His posts have been rating poorly of late.

by KenTX on 03/09/2008 10:23:41 AM EST

[ Parent ]

I was joking though. There's nothing new in politics. Same themes. Bill was born in Hope Arkansas. Obama wrote a book about the audacity of HOPE. Bill's ran on change and "help us on the way."

 Ok. Obama hasn't taken the help is on the way thing, but the other two are being recyled.

by acroso on 03/08/2008 08:04:05 PM EST

[ Parent ]
Dodging the questions again....

any implication that Democrats are weak and would give in to the terrorists polite? Why are they allowed to be complete and utter assholes, but we're not allowed to call them out on it? Cenk

Maybe you could enlighten us as to where you came up with this information other than regurgitating Rush Limbaugh? Prove your lies.

  • Dems think our troops are "Nazis" http://www.theyoungturks.co m/comments/2007/10/25/21313 4/43/102#102
  • Dems are starting their vicious attack on American identity, national religion, taxpayers etc, http://www.theyoungturks.co m/comments/2007/10/22/11525 /191/10#10
  • Voting for Democrats are at best like voting for street bums and at worst a lot like voting for terrorists.http://www.theyo ungturks.com/comments/2007/ 10/14/155517/23/33#33
  • Dems do want to take away our guns and they do want to limit our freedom of speech http://www.theyoungturks.co m/comments/2007/6/20/13312/ 0705/3#3
  • La Raza is running and directing what the dems do http://www.theyoungturks.co m/comments/2007/6/14/16394/ 1135/15#15
  • The dems desire to defeat the troops in Iraq and Afganistan. They want to impeach Bush because that is another way to victory in the war against the war (or another way to defeat the U.S., whichever way you look at it.) http://www.theyoungturks.co m/comments/2007/4/11/112312 /588/9#9
  • Pelosi has set a date for surrender to the terrorists in Iraq, Pelosi has set a date for surrender to the terrorists in Iraq, http://www.theyoungturks.co m/comments/2007/4/11/112312 /588/2#2
  • the Terrorists and the Democrats have had a lot of success in their attempts to break the will to fight of the American people. http://www.theyoungturks.co m/comments/2007/4/9/131553/ 4837/1#1
  • Many Americans have lsot the will to fight the terrorists after the non-stop rhetoric coming from the left and the L&S divisions of our campuses http://www.theyoungturks.co m/comments/2007/4/9/131553/ 4837/1#1
  • The Dems mato is defeat. Common sense tells us they were going to surrender to the terrorists if they took power incongress.This defeatism means implementing dates for withdrawal and defunding the our troops. http://www.theyoungturks.co m/comments/2007/3/28/102731 /281/11#11
  • Nancy hangs the troops out to dry to let the Americans know who the dems really are and to lets the Islamos know that your party supports them http://www.theyoungturks.co m/comments/2007/3/23/14658/ 5848/1#1
  • Go complain to Harry Reid who is heading up the defeat our troopsbillhttp://www.theyou ngturks.com/comments/2007/3 /2/941/60818/2#2
  • the Dems support the troops by supporting their defeat. The dems can't be trusted on any matters of national security.http://www.theyoun gturks.com/comments/2007/2/ 25/61739/1922/63#63
  • I posted his closing speech in the effort to stop the Dems pro-Al Qaeda resolution.http://www.theyo ungturks.com/comments/2007/ 2/25/61739/1922/54#54
  • Dems ARE unpatriotic bafoons, and the republicans aren't. http://www.theyoungturks.co m/comments/2007/2/16/13593/ 4879/2#2
  • Well if there is one thing the Dems don't do is " Caring about our country." They've been working on tearing apart the ideaof what it means to be American since way before the farewell speech of Reagan where he talked about the elimination of nationalpride and collective memory.http://www.theyoungt urks.com/comments/2007/2/17 /22318/8973/22#22
  • the Dem supported the troops by supporting their defeat in the 60s. Now they "support" the troops by supporting their defeatin the war on terror. It comes to reason that the Democrats DO NOT SUPPORT THE TROOPS.http://www.theyoungt urks.com/comments/2007/2/15 /175041/565/41#41
  • How did they manage to trick the voters into this new hope ( Obama ed.) filled bipartisan agenda when the cooks are running their party?http://www.theyoungtu rks.com/comments/2007/2/6/1 1367/49130/2#2
  • Like I said, if it wasn't for the Democrats hindering the war effort, funding, and the troops we'd have won these years ago. What we need is a much larger standing army, more media control, and fewer rules. Unfortunately Al Qaeda has learned to game our media in order to dispirit the American people and the dems just act an amplifier for their message. http://www.theyoungturks.co m/comments/2007/2/2/18320/2 3155/9#9
  • CNN can play the terrorists propaganda vids along side of the dem resolution supporting the terrorists.
  • Well I do know why the dems voted for General Patraeus and his plan for a surge along with giving funding to president Bush for the troops surge yet pass resolutions opposing what they just did\approved. It's all politics. Their rabid anti-American base demands that the dems politicize the war and pretend to not support the troop http://www.theyoungturks.co m/comments/2006/5/3/12955/5 1892/8#8
  • the CNN sniper video of troops getting shot that was filmed by the terrorists in Iraq for propaganda. They want to break the American will so they give the tapes to the libs in our lib media who have like minded goals.  http://www.theyoungturks.co m/comments/2007/1/5/19828/5 3784/2#2
  • The dems are invested in defeat, and cheer it on http://www.theyoungturks.co m/comments/2006/12/3/151518 /361/4#4

by MRFred on 03/08/2008 08:26:25 PM EST

[ Parent ]
You might recall that Fred suffered serious withdrawal pains when acroso disappeared from the forum for three weeks.

He started tacking up "missing" posters.

Jesse Onehitkill actually started crying.

I often wonder what you guys would do if the conservative participants ever disappeared from the forum.

by KenTX on 03/08/2008 10:05:09 PM EST

[ Parent ]
You are right. Your two buddies seem to need trolls to argue with. But the other 1000 people  a day would manage. Why don't you leave and see who is right?

by Chinese Democracy on 03/09/2008 09:00:19 AM EST

[ Parent ]

 you guys would do if the conservative participants ever disappeared from the forum.

Just fine thank you very much...no matter...If/he or she was I wouldnt have a problem with him/her. Acroso's sole funtion is to disrupt with the stupid bullshit I noted above.

You pointed it out yourself on several occasions. If you looking for allies I would recommend not picking the internet reincarnation of the Three Stooges.

He / she is a internet version of Munchausen by Proxy Syndrome (MBPS). Looking for that attention rush. Acroso is different things on different websites...

Here he/she apperently is antiwar.  hey acroso How can we identify you at the Cindy Sheehan Die-in war protest?

Here he/she is a Huckabee supporter  Interesting

Here he /she is a Paul supporter. This post is "Why Paul is Winning" "Remember Goldwater did poorly in primaries but rocked the caucuses and grassroots." Total Posts: 829 (9.85 posts per day) 

Here he/she is an AntiBush Antiwar contributor to the blog site rightwingnthouse

and here he /she is a concerned about human rights and "bigots"

Could there be more than one acroso? Maybe, but the comments and style is the same. What are the chances anyther bloger would chose the nic acroso and hit the same political sites the TYT version acroso  references....is anybody else that goofy? 

Come on, who else would derive ther nic from acrosome...really.

 

by MRFred on 03/09/2008 09:52:10 AM EST

[ Parent ]
"Acroso's sole funtion is to disrupt."
 
I think acroso would be the first to admit this statement is true. It seems that he disrupts every blog that he participates in. He likes it. He could give a one-man workshop on trollology.

It doesn't bother me that acroso is an annoying, obnoxious troll. I've been accused of that myself.

What bothers me is an apparent lack of consistency and honesty and core values. He seems to be a political windsock who is capable of changing on a dime.

I know he likes conservative judicial appointments. I know he likes a secure border. I agree with these positions.

But he shows no loyalty to the GOP when they deliver on these goals.

Acroso is a slippery bar of soap. It bothers me a little. It bothers Fred a lot.




by KenTX on 03/09/2008 10:19:51 AM EST

[ Parent ]

Fred haven't you ever seen Fight Club where Edward Norton goes to all those therapy sessions although he's not actually there because he suffers from whatever those people are there for?

Great Movie!

by acroso on 03/09/2008 04:06:49 PM EST

[ Parent ]
encourages a status quo government.  At the very least it sure as hell doesn't encourage anything good.

by ihavenobias on 03/08/2008 08:41:58 PM EST

[ Parent ]
Came across this new link from a blogger on the Obama site and think you you might enjoy it. Good strategies for framing the attacks from Wolfson et al.
http://headofstate.blogspot .com/2008/03/how-obama-can- win.html
 

by Verified1 on 03/09/2008 06:09:27 AM EST


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