04/08/2008 11:33:45 AM EST
posted by hazmat
but the polls also show that Hillary is doing worse than Obama for this democratic which undercuts her argument that we should nominate her because whites won't vote for Obama.
Just the same, you're right that people are being a little fantastical about expectations in red states. It's promising that Obama has clear appeal among independants and moderate republicans, but, but...
As awful as republicans are at doing the day to day goverment work and oversight, checks and balances etc, they are breathtakingly competent at setting the agenda for the popular media and at winning national elections. They slipped up in '06 because they thought they couldn't lose if they simply impugned the patriotism of their opponents. Their selection of John McCain shows that some of them at least have gotten the memo. He is not your run-of-the-mill candidate.
He is very effectively pandering to the far right and simultaneously reaching out to moderates (see his MLK holiday apology last week) with "plainspeak", which means not that he's being straightforward, but whether you like it or not he is very efficiently portraying himself as such while Hillary is busy making Barack appear like an extremist on the basis of innuendo and guilt by association.
As I have posted several times elsewhere democrats who think Obama is a shoe-in are deluded. I think he's a strong candidate, perhaps the strongest in my lifetime, but he ain't no shoe-in. Sun-Tzu wrote that the art of war is politics by other means, but he was really writing about human behavior. If you read that book and take it to heart, you'll learn not to underestimate the enemy. Regardless of the political climate, recent history, or the polls, make no mistake about it, John McCain has a bright, gleaming path to the presidency, regardless of who we nominate.
First, I disagree with you almost completely about McCain. He is an awful candidate who is going to struggle mightily when the Dems unite behind a candidate (and they will). One rally, presumably in Little Rock, with Hillary hugging Barak will send McCain into a minimum 5 point deficit.
Beyond that the fact that he has so little money he is pathetically challenging Obama to accept public financing with him (despite the fact that he is blatantly violating campaign finance law according to the Republican chairman of the FEC), McCain is living and dying on the media having no interest in actually covering anything he says and does.
It will only take one mainstream reporter (not talk show) on a high profile outlet to begin the onslaught and considering that the only thing these clowns like better than free ribs is having that breakthrough story that gives them tenure McCain is playing a very dangerous game.
Not that his senile ass is aware of any of that.
About red states not mattering that is true but not because they are unwinnable. They are perfectly winnable. Most elections are not decided by fractions of a percent in the deciding state. It is very likely someone will get 350+ EVs. Maybe even 450+. Obviously this would mean flipping a bunch of states. That is how it usually works, just not in 2000 and 2004.
From 1920-1996 there were 20 elections. Four were decided by fewer than 200 EVs. (1976 by 57, 1968 by 110, 1960 by 84 and 1948 by 114). It is more likely than not that some solid red states will go blue or vice versa.
The reason the Oklahomas and Utahs don't matter is that by the time the Dems win those states they will have won all the tossup states and won the election anyway. Playing the Dem nomination game to improve your chances in Indiana is playing for a massive landslide, not playing to win the White House.
Also, I have never understood the logic that if one primary candidate wins a state they are more likely to win that state in the general. It seems to me since primaries are usually decided by party loyalists and close states in the general are decided by crossover other party voters and independents there would be little correlation between relative primary strength to the other candidate and strength in the general. Theoretically the party loyalists (who tend to vote in primaries) will vote for either one.
Anyway, that said, the states to watch, in my humble opinion, are the Southwest states of NM, CO and NV. All look good for the Dems and would allow us to win without OH and FL.
In the midwest, MI and MN have to stay blue but they have been more dem than the country since JFK won. MI and WI have to go Dem as well. This seems likely barring a nationwide shift to the right. MI and WI were wooed by Reagan but have been blue since 92. Also the area is ravaged by the economy which should hurt the GOP there.
You will hear a lot of talk about OH and FL but I am not sure they matter that much. Florida will go red in a 50/50 election and Ohio is a true tossup.
Ohio is fascinating. What will Buckeyes vote against? Will they decide their vote on revulsion of the massive GOP corruption in the state and the horrific economy or will their racist tendencies cause them to ignore all that to stop a man based on the color of his skin. Ohio is a microcosm of the entire GOP strategy. I do not believe the dems have to have it to win but the GOP absolutely does and it will probably be the most interesting state to watch.
Oh, and if McCain has to spend a single penny running ads in Texas, he is on his way to getting Mondaled. Don't believe it can happen? Beware the brown, my GOP firends.
I don't think Hillary's racist, and that's not what it says up there at the top of the thread. I referenced her racial spin. Okay I'll admit the word "exposed" kinda maybe implies racism. Sorry for the exaggeration--that's not what I meant. I meant that her false claim is exposed. Its well known that she's pushing the narrative that white people in swing states won't vote for a black guy. I just talked to a Hillary supporter today who said the same thing. Okay, he's not an official surrogate, but this is the buzz. Is it wrong?
About polls, yes, it's healthy to be skeptical about polls. But the ones that are done scientifically are real, hard data. They are statistics and one should be careful in their interpretation, but dismissing them out of hand is no more prudent than overinterpreting them. In this case, I put them up because Hillary's camp made the claim that Barack enjoys less of the white vote and thus will be a weaker general election candidate. There's nothing wrong with that claim, because it is falsifiable. These data suggest--but do not prove--that her claim is flat out wrong. They also imply that the opposite may be true. More evidence may come to light which shows something different, but until then, you can't simply discard real data because you don't like polls. Are you suggesting we trade opinions ad nauseum until one of us is forced to change our minds on the basis of the other having a more forceful opinion?