Meet the Press worth it this week (long commentary)

Google Technorati del.icio.us digg reddit
If you like this story, digg it!

Meet the Press online  - actually worth watching this week.

The highlight for me was the interview with Jim Webb and a fun moment when Bob Shrum - infamous loser - told Huckabee...

MR. SHRUM:  You don't have to be culturally--well, actually, I endorsed you for president.  I thought the Republicans should've nominated you, and I think maybe McCain should pick you for vice president.  And I mean that with all due respect.

MR. RUSSERTThere goes that bid.

GOV. HUCKABEEYeah, I'm toast.  The torpedo.


Now, everyone is going to hear certain things that amaze/stun/outrage them on shows like this. (This is the REAL reason people shouldn't keep coffee cups near their monitors) Sometimes it's the questions, sometimes it's the answers.

I picked a few which seemed egregious to me, plus I decided to take pity on the poor reader and merely bore them to tears instead of to a vegetative state...remember I said this when you're halway through.

Admittedly out of context, if you want to see the complete framing and what the full answers were, go follow the link, ya lazy bastid!

MR. RUSSERT:  The Pentagon, the administration and other editorials across the country have said the problem with the bill is that if, after three years people can leave with full benefits, it'll be very difficult to retain good soldiers, to have them re-enlist.

This was asked of Jim Webb, who is championing a return to the G.I. Bill of WW2 Vets. What he said was correct politically, I suppose, but what **I** would have said is:

"Well, Tim, maybe they're right! I guess the only way to know for sure is to get those editorial writers, Pentagon and Admi nistration people - hell, whoever else has a problem with it as being "too rewarding" - out to Sadr City, Basra, or Southern Afghanistan and let THEM decide 'How Long IS Long Enough To Earn Full Benefits.' There's a certain incentive that comes with bullets whizzing by and things blowing up around you that you just can't get the feel of in a newspaper editorial board or a cushy Washington office."

MR. RUSSERT:  In the debate over Iraq, which we're going to see this fall, Barack Obama will say have a withdrawal of troops over 16-month period, and John McCain said the other day his goal is to have them out by 2013, but there would be a continued force there.  How do the Democrats argue withdrawal from Iraq without being perceived as weak on foreign or defense policy?

I can't blame him, but he really blew this one. In the same way Democrats have been blowing it for decades. What **I** would have said:

"Tim, I see your premise as flawed. The Democrats ARE strong on defense - they always have been. Look who has been in charge of the disastrous foreign policy of the last eight years, stretching our forces beyond reason, holding our valiant troops hostage with 'stop loss', refusing to pursue aggressive diplomacy, plunging the world into an energy crisis, destroying Habeas Corpus, engaging in the most vile of methods to torture prisoners in our care in defiance of our Geneva treaties. It's the REPUBLICANS who have PROVEN themselves to be incapable of responsible national safety.

It is our very PRESENCE in Iraq which is a root cause of our weakness in foreign policy and world standing. We have no credibility! The world KNOWS we lied our way into an invasion and seen what the effects have been on the world wide economy, and they want to know WHY we are continuing this madness.

If we are to follow another Republican, John McCain, devout Conservative and completely behind the Bush Folly, we will find ourselves ostracized and ignored. We have to help Iraq to rebuild in any way we can, but we MUST remove combat troops in order to give them a CHANCE to stabilize. Right now, we are acting as the hired militia of al Malaki, and I guarantee you this is another "Bush Bungle" which will come back to bite us squarely in the ass."

Sleepy yet? There's more. We still have the 'round table'...in response to a query about "Aren't we worse off, danger wise, from Iran than we were when Bush ascended to the throne?" Okay, that's paraphrasing a bit, but you get the gist...

FMR. GOV. MIKE HUCKABEE (R-AR):  Well, I would disagree that the reason that we're worse off is because of what George Bush has done.  I think it's a little bit disingenuous to say that it's all his fault that things are more dangerous with Iran than they were.

Yeah...let's look at that a bit, and, Russert? Feel free to jump in with an occasional fact or two so we know that you're actually AWARE of this stuff,  mmm-kay?

2000 - According to the CIA World Factbook (scroll all the way down), under Transnational Issues, the United States isn't even listed. Huh.

Shortly after 9/11, in Iran, Tehran's main soccer stadium observed an unprecedented minute's silence in sympathy with the victims. Iran's Ayatollah Imami Kashani spoke of a catastrophic act of terrorism which could only be condemned by all Muslims, adding the whole world should mobilise against terrorism. People took to the streets of Tehran for a candlelight vigil in honor of the victims.

candlelight vigil

Shortly before we invaded Afghanistan, by Oct 2001, Iran let us know exactly where they stood and offered reasonable aid for a country not wanting to get directly involved in a conflict with a neighbor.

And then, on January 29, 2002, George Bush, at his idiotic best, channeled the works of neoconservative Yossef Bodansky from a decade earlier as he labeled Iran one-third of an "axis of evil" which existed primarily in the imagination of the most unimaginative people ever to be put in positions of authority.

Since then, there has been nothing but threats, coercion, sanctions, financial blockages, and a fear mongering campaign unseen since the days of...2002 and Saddam Hussein...

Conclusion? Iran is certainly, clearly, and understandably a MUCH greater danger to our interests than when Bush entered the White House. He made SURE of it! Thing is, They are STILL nothing to get our panties in a twist about!

Good news is, it can still be salvaged if we get someone on it who actually understands the culture and doesn't have Big Oil's interests at the forefront. (So...NOT John McCain)

MR. MURPHY:  Well, the politics of it were a bit of a jumble.  The policy I think is a winner for John McCain.  Even Hillary Clinton, representing about half the Democratic votes, said it was irresponsible and naive for Barack Obama to adopt this essentially equivalency policy that the horrible dictator of Iran should be treated like the prime minister of Denmark and have any kind of conversation.

There was a half-hearted effort to correct this bullshit, but the roar machine took over and drowned it out. This would have been one of those Russert, "Hey! I KNOW this one" moments - except he obviously didn't. Weak sauce, but it splashed all over the plate.

MR. FORD:  What it says is that conservative Democrats--Democrats have a message from this, too.  We can't run a liberal campaign.  It was a conservative Democrat, moderate Democrat approach.  That approach is on the ascendancy in the party.  If Barack Obama adopts that approach, he will enjoy more success in many places around the country and might be able to expand a map to the extent that his team is suggesting, in North Carolina, in Georgia, and even Mississippi.  There's a lesson for Democrats as well, and I hope we take it.

It took a long time, but Harold finally got around to making his Democratic Leadership Council (DLC) right-wingie, compromisey, weak ass message in there. Obama has been winning precisely because he is doing the opposite of what this "friend of Hillary" suggests. Let the districts which need to run conservative run conservative, but the LEADER of the party should hold up the TRUE ideals, not the compromised middle-of-the-road, Republican lite crap which has lost us the last two elections. Run as a DEMOCRAT, damn it!

MR. MURPHY:  Now, after these defeats, everybody's a McCainiac now over in the House of Representatives, which is a change, but a good one.  And I, I think McCain is well-positioned to do well if he runs the campaign that is who he really is, which is a centrist and a change agent.

We'll take our leave on this Republican note of hilarity. Again, I wish there had been a bit more protest - maybe a spit take or actual vomiting - from the others because you KNOW there are people who heard that and will be thinking of the self-confessed "100% Conservative" McCain and believe he is a moderate.

< Sen. Robert C. Byrd endorses Obama | Hagee = douchebag >
 Display:
that I actually Russert and his show?  I think 9 times out of 10 he generally asks really good questions and talks a lot about political realities that other shows avoid.

by jarett on 05/18/2008 07:41:13 PM EST


This is the sort of stuff you grew up on, so it's what you expect. Perfectly understandable.

As you may have noticed, I am very nostalgic for certain aspects of America of M-m-m-m-my Generation (not the racism, coups, etc.) like how shows like Meet The Press had a panel of reporters and the guest would face them and answer questions, not be interviewed by a host and then have a bunch of pundits funnel what was said through their private spin machine.

If you like Russert, more power to you. I mean, he's a highly respected political mucky-muck at NBC and I'm a just a fat old guy typing away while listening to a leaf blower blasting outside my window. If I were you, I'd probably put more stock in Russert, too...

by MedfordTim on 05/19/2008 01:29:50 PM EST

[ Parent ]
Ford I take it is Harold Ford?  Who's Murphy?  The "what he should have said" suggestions were good.

I thought I would like these summaries of MTP and all. Huffington Post does it of course. But it turns out I don't like them. I don't trust the authors enough, even if it's a person in whom I do have confidence like MedfordTim.

Those questions in the Republican framing, like the one about Democrats being weak on defense. Can't you argue that Russert is only phrasing the question that way to prod the interviewee and to give him or her the set up to state their mind on the issue?

Of course this is allowable only if they challenge Republicans in the same way, with the liberal or Democratic framing.  I suppose they don't do that as often, but I caution you. When you do think like many of us do here, it's harder to perceive questions that are asked in the liberal framing because to us that isn't a "frame", it's reality.  So the right wing framed questions stand out more and we get outraged.

David

by yturks on 05/19/2008 11:51:59 AM EST


Yes, Harold Dord. Murphy is a Republican strategist.

I know it means more reading, but there is a transcript at the site. I, for one, am thankful because it makes it much easier to transcribe when I cut and paste.

"Can't you argue that Russert is only phrasing the question that way to prod the interviewee..."

Yes, possibly even persuasively, but it begs the question 'why does he choose that framing?' Is he prodding for a 'gotcha' statement or is he trying to get to the facts? Understandably, he wants his show to be entertaining, I just think it's sad when he goes for the Morton Downey question instead of the Edward R Murrow one.

He sets the starting point that it's the DEMS who must argue their point against a perceived Republican position of military and foreign policy strength.

"How do the Democrats argue withdrawal from Iraq without being perceived as weak on foreign or defense policy?" - Russert

His underlying premise is that Dems are already 'weak' and pretty much any argument they present will also be so - typical Republican speak. He could just as easily have asked "How will Obama's withdrawl from Iraq plan affect our foreign or defense policies?"

This sort of question would be more amenable to someone wanting to state their issue. Instead, they have to begin by defending a strawman argument so they come off as whiners and apologists over nothing.

What does the audience take away from it?

Thanks

by MedfordTim on 05/19/2008 01:09:59 PM EST

[ Parent ]

I watched this and felt the same way about every one of your points. I really wish the same Jim Webb that told Bush to stuff it at that meet-'n-greet two years ago would show up on sundays.

Mike Huckabee trying to squeeze in that talking point about how the failure of Iraq isn't really Bush's fault had me in stitches. The guy has a red bulbous nose and the big shoes. He's a clown to say that on national television. I also totally agree with your comments about Ford, although its nice to see DLC types finally hitching their fortunes to the Obama bandwagon.

One thought that occurred to me watching the roundtable was that all the pundits sounded very oldschool and dated all of a sudden. The democrats weren't really in tune with Obama's message, and the conservatives haven't really bought into McCain, even though both sides still kept up the pretense of the laughable "crossfire" defense of their party's presumptive nominees. I think its indicative that the american people voted against the punditry in this election as much as for their own candidates. It is truly a change election.

by hazmat on 05/19/2008 03:01:58 PM EST


Although, to contradict myself above, Jim Webb was emphasizing on the issue of the GI bill that he did not want to politicize the issue. Coming from that point of view his answer to this question was appropriately framed I think. Remember he has republican cosponsors, and is in effect representing them also.

by hazmat on 05/19/2008 03:06:52 PM EST

[ Parent ]
That's why I gave him the "correct politically" tag.

Just another reason he is an esteemed Senator and I am me. :-)

by MedfordTim on 05/19/2008 05:23:25 PM EST

[ Parent ]
 Display: