TYT Site Suggestion: Avoiding Conservative Spam

I choose to blog conservative propaganda in a left leaning forum. KenTX

I have been listening to TYT on the web and reading the website for a couple of months now and I am very pleased TYT is now broadcasting on AA on XM.

I have considered joining TYT but there are some very serious issues that need to be addressed first. Perhaps a member can answer. There seems to be a great deal of conversation about trolls, who is and who is not, what is censorship and what is entertainment.

The main question is when does entertainment become paid advertising or more disturbingly , open proselytisation pretending to be opinion. The same argument has been applied to Fox news and other websites that present conservative opinion as bona fide news.

Let me be clear,so called conservatives,  like Ken Tx ( I only choose him because he seems to be the most frequent posted by far ) other users classify as trolls have every right to express an opinion and exercise their right of free speech in a open public forum, virtual or otherwise. Remember this point.

However, once a media outlet crosses over from free public access to paid membership, a line is crossed. And that is my concern. I want to become a paid member of TYT but I do not want to be subjected to unsolicited conservative spam. Why do I make that statement?

At TYT it has become increasingly obvious that at least one paid ( contributing) member leverages his contributions as a way to spread conservative propaganda , misinformation ( and in some instances, abuse) and now McCain campaign material on the cheap. Since this user is also a major contributor the lack of action by a TYT moderator implies TYT endorsement of those positions, at least in part.

I have suspected that to be the case since I started  reading the TYT forum and listening to the show. I have also read posts by users and sources internal to TYT stating the same. Now with the quote referenced in the prologue, and below, I believe I can say that in fact, is the case.

What you managed to do was bring in 40 comments, and multiple viewers to the McCain ad. Mission Accomplished. KenTX

I assume that paid advertisers do not get unlimited access to TYT to openly spread their un-vetted material as fact nor are they allowed to present campaign material as unsolicited opinion.

If the above is the case, TYT is really, borrowing a phrase from another member,a paid spam portal. You are registering and perhaps paying for the pleasure of being spammed by conservative causes masquerading as a user.

The solution to this problem is the ability to opt out of posts or material by specific posters by contributing members. Unpaid members would not have this ability thus making the distinction between a free and open public forum and a membership site.

Many of the TYT users in question may throw up the straw man of censorship. That is a fallacious argument . They indeed have the right to speak in a free and open public forum. That right is not infringed upon by my suggestion.

Conversely, I also have the right not to listen, particularly at a paid membership site. Whether I do that on my own by ignoring the poster as an unpaid member, or as a paid member utilizing a programmatic opt out function, in essence, paying TYT to do that for me, there is no difference.

Either way, I will not be subjected to conservative spaming.

< McCain even lying about ABBA | active combat troops support Obama to McCain 6-1!!! >
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I'm one of the so called trolls and a paying member here on TYT, and we could argue all day about what a "troll" is defined as, especially here with this crowd, but I must say your post has raised some interesting and potentially positive things for this site.

I especially like the bit about paying vs. non paying members getting the option to opt out of particular posters comments. I guess anything is possible, but Im not sure their servers/moderator has the capability to do such an action. Its an interesting thought...

I would like to welcome you as a new listener and poster - I am not going to tell you to buy a membership etc - I'll let some of the local water carriers do that for me - but I will say that we do have a strong and growing community here, many with differing if not outlandish opinions sometime. I personally wouldnt want to come to this site if people were blocked out, because each one of us has a role and a place here and we are learning to strenghten our beliefs and counterpoints by sharing them with the others...

I would hate to see Dave our moderator turn to DailyKos tactics of removing posts that have the slightest twinge of Conservatism (I myself have had that done to me at Kos for ery minor 1 time statements), but at the same time, I agree that as a potential paying member I would not want to pay for being what one might consider being "spammed" by beliefs that are counter to your own...

Again, thank you for your post - it is truly one of the first ones in a while that has got me seriously considering emailing Dave to support a change in this format...

bobo1

:)

by bobo1 on 08/16/2008 04:28:29 PM EST

Kozlo could be posting exactly what and spamming this way would still be out of line.

It has nothing to do with the views, its the method.

by ProfRich on 08/16/2008 05:34:18 PM EST

[ Parent ]

If you think Cenk does a good show, support him. GE isn't going to do it. Pratt & Wittney's not on board. You can forget about Clorox. You get what you pay for. Its some of the best money I spend in my monthly budget. Cenk is closest to me in his political views out of all the political talk shows I've heard, and he broadcasts to a large audience. If he weren't on the air, I wouldn't feel represented. If he has any influence on the weakling organization of bucklers we call the democratic party, that's all for the better.

The forum and your perception of its usefulness should be unrelated to your decision to become a member, since you don't have to pay to participate. I became a paying member years before I even looked at the forum. During the primary I decided I needed an outlet to vent and this was the perfect place. Despite the trolls, you'll find over time that some of the posters here are very thoughtful. The community has other benefits, for example it is much smaller than other venues like Kos, and consequently it is easy to make friends (and enemies!). Not being homogenous in political outlook has other advantages. But I like your suggestion to be able to block users on an individual basis. On the whole it doesn't seem that necessary, and I would use it very seldomly (Kozlo and Chinese Democracy are the two I would single out). Perhaps you should have the right to do that as a paying customer. Kozlo is a special case because he is clearly spamming the site. Ken and bobo do not fit in that category in my opinion. It seems simpler to just skip over the posts you don't wish to read, though.

by hazmat on 08/16/2008 05:29:30 PM EST

that new nitwit Kozlo on the other side: he just spams every thread with the same cut and paste messages over and over again

by callisto on 08/16/2008 07:16:32 PM EST

you mean MrFred? because he hasn't even been in this thread

by callisto on 08/16/2008 08:44:54 PM EST

[ Parent ]
but even if thats you MRFred, welcome!!!

:)

by bobo1 on 08/16/2008 11:21:56 PM EST

[ Parent ]
Why is it that every time a new blogger shows up that doesn't seem to like you and your posts that person somehow becomes my sock puppet?

Blogs run in cycles. Your blogs are predictable, they repeat like a bad TV show. Ive been around here long enough to say that you probably have a schedule of some type. Military is Republican, Democrats hate America , We're Killing Al Qeada!, Conservatism is on the March, Limbaugh is right because he's rich.., Privatize every thing, Clinton is a Rapist and on and on and on. You even repost the same old graphs and graphics.

On the other hand ( or side) every few months we get:

  • The "troll" blog.
  • How to improve the web site.( Ignored)
  • The Armenian Spammer ( Cenk Attacks)
  • Im a proud Conservative and I just want to debate!
  • Fet-a-rama; Rabid pro-life spam and fetus Photoshops
  • Some spam for Alex Jones or conspiracy sites ( that was probably acroso)
  • KenTx sock puppets

Please...find a new axis of sock puppets. But I can say that after reading Dave's response you know where the website, particularly the Forum fits into the TYT pecking order.

by MRFred on 08/17/2008 10:18:28 AM EST

[ Parent ]
Not fair to say that suggestions on site improvement are ignored. I'd say about 10% of the suggestions are implemented (maybe 5%).  All the rest I definitely take into account, but for various reasons they don't get implemented - not enough time, not enough expertise, not practical, not really improvements, downside is too large. I feel bad when there are clear improvements we don't make, and with time I'd like to implement all the good ideas.

David

by yturks on 08/17/2008 10:29:10 AM EST

[ Parent ]
He clearly reads and tries to respond as well as possible to many complaints.

by ProfRich on 08/17/2008 01:13:21 PM EST

[ Parent ]
Will get you much understanding from us members.  I think we sometimes forget the constraints that TYT works within, probably because the show itself is so well done and fabulous.  People will generally be much more patient and understanding if they know that you hear the concerns, but can't implement everything you would like to right away.  Thanks for listening and posting here Dave.

by desertpear on 08/17/2008 04:18:48 PM EST

[ Parent ]
You thought Medford Tim and I were sock puppets...for months.

I cant take credit for the bytchbang victory, my wife a Doctor Phil type...( unfortunately she never got rich with quack pop medicine)read his posts for me.

She said he had real abandonment and lost sibling issues ...probably by the overbearing father...  He was most likely an orphan late in childhood and  passed from family to family as an unwanted child. That fueled his maniacal fixation with abortion and that he  compensated with an over developed self image and a low tolerance for criticism...or differing opinions, all of which he took as personal attacks.Of course those fueled personal attacks therefore reinforcing that behavior. Based on that and his frequent Im going to quit TYT rants he was probably unsuccessful at personal relationships, jobs and other tasks choosing to leave or quit before he was "abandoned" first.

She said either ignore him or take away something he cherished and he'll leave...and the goofy handle he used came to mind. Bytchbanq was born. He freaked and thought someone had hacked his account and stole his "identity" and his personal information.  His name by the way was B. B. Brown...the idiot had a blog and that was in his bio.

Of course she could have been totally wrong ,BB may have been a plain old thin skinned redneck asshole. I may have just got lucky..either way I'll take it.

So I openly admit to using  sock puppets for strategic reasons only only to thwart the spread of conservative raving lunatics flamers. First they knock off small sites like TYT then, like dominoes, they spread ...JFK said it best:

Now, we have been able to hold this line against this internal subversion by the Conservative raving lunatics flamers, as well as the external threat of Conservative invasion, because for many years the TYT has assisted these progressive websites in meeting their own problems. We are assisting the people of TYT. We are assisting websites from Air America which are faced with staggering problems. If we stop helping them, they will become ripe for internal subversion and a Conservative raving lunatics flamers.

by MRFred on 08/18/2008 10:40:22 AM EST

[ Parent ]
Like our dear friend KenTX, not even John Edwards ;)

by desertpear on 08/16/2008 10:03:03 PM EST

[ Parent ]
I have it on good authority that he waxes his mustache.

by OneHitKill on 08/17/2008 05:44:23 AM EST

[ Parent ]
There is a simple point that hasn't been made here.  Being a TYT Member provides access benefits to listen and watch the show with greater convenience; TYT membership does not provide any advantages in posting diaries and comments on the website.  The website is open to everybody except those who post blatantly destructive diaries or comments.

There are some valid questions about what should be posted on the site and what should be blocked. If the users of the site were equally split between pro-Republican and pro-Democratic Party, that might be an issue because that's not what this site is supposed to be. For now, KenTX is in a tiny, tiny minority here so he's fine.

David

by yturks on 08/16/2008 08:44:48 PM EST

When a true conservative troll comes on, and spams each thread with right-wing talking points that are not even on-topic, what IS the procedure for requesting that they be banned?  I figure it is probably just on a case-by-case basis, but how far does a person have to go to get banned?  If you wait until things get too nasty, it will drive people away from the forum. 

by desertpear on 08/16/2008 10:02:24 PM EST

[ Parent ]
I've been a member for quite a while now, and I also donate extra money just at random.  I stalk you because you personally attack me every chance you get.  If my posts are vulgar, tough shit you fucking dickwad.

by desertpear on 08/16/2008 10:41:42 PM EST

[ Parent ]

You want my fangs to fold back again?

Of coooouuurssse I'm a member!  I love his Cenkness.

by desertpear on 08/16/2008 11:12:56 PM EST

[ Parent ]

I wasn't even referring to YOU, although you must have identified with the description.  I was willing to bury the hatchet with you, but now...

I am sooo happy you made that mistake about me not being a member.  neener neener neener.  

by desertpear on 08/16/2008 10:45:24 PM EST

[ Parent ]
he's not truly engaging in debate, just spamming threads

by desertpear on 08/17/2008 07:45:57 AM EST

[ Parent ]
Dave, I understand. Money and time is an issue, and I even wrote that in my thread asking for suggestions on how to improve the quality of the discussion forum. I mentioned that some things may not be practical and asked for cheap/free suggestions.

At any rate, you make some good points. I would only add that because it's true that membership doesn't have anything to do with the forum, donations are accepted. If someone donates to improve the forum, there is a text box where they can explain why they're donating, so they should use it.

Finally, as I said to Zippy before...

If someone's goal is to have a good discussion and debate and we disagree with them (even strongly) it should be 100% ok. 

But if someone's goal is to (consistently) annoy, inflame disrupt or spam, it's 100% not ok. They should get a warning and then the boot.

That's my take anyway. And I'm glad you responded in this thread BTW, I appreciate it.

by Tom Hanc on 08/17/2008 12:07:02 PM EST

[ Parent ]
Please note that I didn't just fall back on the excuses of lack of money and time. I also mentioned expertise.  Money by itself can't bring all the features or modifications that somebody might request.

David

by yturks on 08/17/2008 09:02:18 PM EST

[ Parent ]

I'm good.

I can piss off lefties and righties just by asking them to look in the mirror. 

by z1p101 on 08/17/2008 10:52:54 PM EST

[ Parent ]
I'm not pissed. Mildly annoyed yes, but pissed? Nah.

So congratulations, you're good at annoying a variety of people.

:)

by Tom Hanc on 08/18/2008 12:01:51 AM EST

[ Parent ]

Ken's post is his usual bloviating victory lap nonsense (spellcheck doesn't recognize bloviate!  Of course it doesn't recognize spellcheck either.)  but it made me think.

I can't remember the last time I heard Rush on the radio.

I used to hear him quite a bit just traveling through the world but it has been years.  Just a thought.

by ProfRich on 08/16/2008 11:57:52 PM EST

I was out last night with a buddy (who is a very moderate American) and I mentioned Limbaugh's anger at the news item about Michael Phelps's extraordinary diet.  My friend was confused for a second and said, "Wait a minute....Rush Limbaugh...Rush Limbaugh...who is that again?"  And when I told him, he said, "Oh right!  Damn, he still has a show?"

I'll say it again: Rush Limbaugh is a has-been.

by OneHitKill on 08/17/2008 05:50:50 AM EST

[ Parent ]
Michael Jackson and Rush Limbaugh.  I couldn't have made a better analogy myself.

by OneHitKill on 08/17/2008 12:15:55 PM EST

[ Parent ]
Rush has the disease of chemical dependency.  The abuse / dependence on opioids scar the dopamine receptors.  Also the mu receptors are affected.  Once an addict always an addict.  One who has been both physiologically and psychologically dependent on any substance are either an addict in recovery or an addict using.  If he is a billionaire my speculation would be he is still using. Hence the limp dick.  Hence the isolative behavior he is noted for.  For all you dudes out there, take this to heart.  Addiction to opiates can ruin your sex life.  That is, ones libido or desire deminishes.  You might even get caught breaking the law smuggling Viagra into the country like Limbaugh did.  The script was in someone elses name and illegal.  BTW, others don't have Cheney to threaten judges and D.A.s with their jobs if  they were  to get  caught  with  fraudulent  prescriptions.

by psyche2 on 08/17/2008 03:45:41 PM EST

[ Parent ]
the last 8 years his pay was $31.25 million a year per year, his new 8 year contract is worth $400 million

how is he billionaire? does he have a a league of side businesses as Oprah???

Oprah's salary in 2008: $385 million ! They aren't even in the same league, again with your delusions

by callisto on 08/17/2008 06:51:09 AM EST

[ Parent ]

$240 million over last 8 years + $400 million over next ten + $200 million signing bonus = billionaire!

Nice work, engineer.

So I guess he might be a billionaire if he had $160 million laying around in 2000 and has spent less than his ancillary incomes and investments made over the last 8 years (Underage Caribbean hooker trips, drug addictions, multiple wives and giant houses ain't cheap, plus doesn't he cover the overhead for his show?) and he can continue to do so until 2018 then he might be a billionaire sometime after then end of the second Obama term.

by ProfRich on 08/17/2008 08:10:32 AM EST

[ Parent ]

I don't care.

I don't measure worth by wealth.  Y'all tried that and we got George Bush.  Thanks!

I don't care how rich Rush is, it could not be more clear he is a miserable piece of shit.  Let's see, drug addiction, serial divorces, junkets to rape underage Caribbean hookers to try and sate his unbelievable loneliness, massive overeating.

I am soooooooo jealous.

Oh, and he is a fraction as rich as Oprah, so we beat you at your own game.

Thanks for playing.

by ProfRich on 08/17/2008 01:10:44 PM EST

[ Parent ]
you are truely a pathetic human being

by callisto on 08/17/2008 04:01:19 PM EST

[ Parent ]
it still doesn't make him a billionaire

you cons are the ultimate dancing queen, hoping from one point to another when it's been prooven wrong

I see you zigging and zagging

by callisto on 08/17/2008 03:59:39 PM EST

[ Parent ]
A picture of McCain as the Dancing Queen.

by desertpear on 08/17/2008 04:20:18 PM EST

[ Parent ]

deal still fell well short of Stern's. All Howard had to do was sign on for a satellite radio deal.

Puts things in perspective, doesn't it? 

by z1p101 on 08/18/2008 12:35:41 AM EST

[ Parent ]

I have a suggestion for you. *

"If you give me $500 million today, I can easily turn it into a billion dollars in seven years. That's how fast well invested money doubles."

Invest it in coal liquefying plants like you always run your yap about and it will happen. 

Oh wait, The price per barrel of oil will drop to $20 in 2 to 4 years according to you which means you will take a bath on that one o_o.

Back to the drawing board I guess?

 

*Disclaimer, just pointing out Ken's idiotic logic. 

by z1p101 on 08/18/2008 01:18:24 AM EST

[ Parent ]

Would it be a good idea to invest in coal liquefaction if the price is (as you claim) going to continue to fall to $20 a barrel?

Ken, it's not energy, it's investing in commodities and widgets.

That is why your father is terrified to hand the company over to you. 

by z1p101 on 08/18/2008 01:55:00 AM EST

[ Parent ]

That is why your father is terrified to hand the company over to you.

HEY.  That's private information. 

by OneHitKill on 08/18/2008 03:15:18 AM EST

[ Parent ]

You are not addicted to hillbilly heroin, sex with underage girls, divorce or food.

Or maybe you are.  I dunno.

by ProfRich on 08/18/2008 01:32:03 AM EST

[ Parent ]
Again, I must discourage you guys from divulging private information like that.  You're gonna get sued!

by OneHitKill on 08/18/2008 05:28:28 AM EST

[ Parent ]
as well. Podcasts? You guys are just now getting into Walkmans.

by MRFred on 08/17/2008 01:42:15 PM EST

[ Parent ]
Now we know where can go to avoid reality and be carried away to a fantasy world were Global Warming doesn't exist, all polls show Republican candidates ahead, women know their place ( and how to use a loofa), the economy is always"strong" the Negroes are all happily working in the fields and Jerome Corsi is taken seriously.

by MRFred on 08/17/2008 01:38:50 PM EST

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