Shmoopie Gay Penguins

Gay penguin dads in German zoo hatch their first chick.

http://latimesblogs.latimes .com/unleashed/2009/06/gay- penguin-dads-in-german-zoo- hatch-chick.html

Z and Vielpunkt, two male Humboldt penguins at Germany's Bremerhaven Zoo, are the proud new parents of a healthy penguin chick.

"Another couple threw the egg out of their batch. We picked it up and put it in the nest of the gay penguins," veterinarian Joachim Schöne told the German newspaper Bild of the pair's entry into parenthood. Z and Vielpunkt faithfully cared for their adopted egg for more than a month; in late April it hatched.  Since then, they've been taking care of their chick around the clock; it's still too young to feed itself, so the dads feed him fish mash, Schöne explained.

"Since the chick arrived, they have been behaving just as you would expect a heterosexual couple to do," the zoo said in a statement.

The Bremerhaven Zoo's same-sex penguin couples (there are three such pairs in residence there, all males) first made news back in 2005, according to the BBC.  At the time, the zoo announced plans to "test" the sexual orientations of the six penguins, who'd been seen engaging in mating rituals and trying to incubate rocks as if they were eggs.  Gay rights advocates were outraged when the zoo brought four new female penguins into the colony in a bid to encourage the penguins to reproduce, and the zoo later nixed the idea.  (In the zoo's defense, Humboldt penguins are classified as vulnerable to extinction, so it does make a certain amount of sense to be concerned about them reproducing.  And since Z and Vielpunkt have done just that, everyone wins!)

 Z and Vielpunkt aren't the first same-sex penguin pair to successfully care for a chick.  Another such couple were male chinstrap penguin residents of New York's Central Park Zoo named Roy and Silo.  Roy and Silo, much like the Bremerhaven penguins, were so anxious to hatch an egg that they tried incubating a rock. They were eventually given an "orphaned" fertile egg and successfully raised a female chick named Tango.

Another male penguin couple were removed from their colony in a Chinese zoo last year when they repeatedly tried to steal eggs from male-and-female pairs.  (In a rather ingenious move, they actually replaced the eggs they were stealing with rocks.)  But visitors complained when the penguins were removed, and eventually they were given two eggs of their own.  Since then, a keeper told the Daily Mail, "they've turned out to be the best parents in the whole zoo."

--Lindsay Barnett

< Four Reasons Why the Public Health Care Option is Irrefutable | Constitutionality of Banning Same-Sex Marriage >

Poll

Should Gay Penguins be allowed to adopt?
Yes!...Of course! 77%
No...it's unnatural...make the Mama-Penguin keep her egg. 0%
No...if no hetero-penguins want the eggs, throw them out. 0%
No...it makes God angry 22%

Votes: 18
Results | Other Polls
 Display:
The fact that there are close to 1,500 species (and counting) with observed homosexuality blows a huge whole in the "it's a choice" or "it's because they were molested" argument. In fact, homosexuality might be a biological adaption for some:

"Almost a quarter of black swan families are parented by homosexual couples. Male couples sometimes mate with a female just to have a baby. Once she lays the egg, they chase her away, hatch the egg, and raise a family on their own." Apparently this an advantage because two males do a better job of protecting their territory than one male and one female.

by ihavenobias on 06/11/2009 04:43:05 PM EST

its a natural method of population control.

by birdboy1 on 06/11/2009 05:23:43 PM EST

[ Parent ]

in almost every animal species there have been observations of homosexuality. IN FACT there are entire SPECIES that are ENTIRELY female (meaning they're all lesbians.... ummmm.... lesbians... niiiiiiice). only people who are willfully ignorant can still say homosexuality is "unnatural." it so obviously isn't as it happens naturally everywhere with a pretty steady 10% chance of happening.

 

i think so far only insect's haven't had any observations of homosexuality.

by kingbane on 06/11/2009 05:29:55 PM EST

[ Parent ]
there are entire SPECIES that are ENTIRELY female
how would that work?

by birdboy1 on 06/11/2009 05:33:33 PM EST

[ Parent ]

http://www.sciencemag.org/c gi/content/abstract/135/349 9/212

 

apparently there are 6 species of lizard in that genus that are entirely female.

 

oh and i made a mistake earlier i didn't mean nearly ALL animals, i meant nearly all mammalian animals. so far homosexuality has been observed less frequently in fish, and lizards, though they still occur. aquatic mammals too have also been observed to have some who are born homosexual.

by kingbane on 06/11/2009 05:45:26 PM EST

[ Parent ]
virtually all female, possible.  Having a species that is completely female, however, is impossible.  Animals cannot breed outside their species and produce fertile offspring, so they would need some males inside the species in order to exist

by birdboy1 on 06/11/2009 05:51:49 PM EST

[ Parent ]
New Mexico Whiptail, as well as several other all-female species of whiptail lizard, does reproduce, and all of its offspring are female. Moreover, it reproduces by parthenogenesis -- its eggs require no fertilization, and its offspring are exact and complete genetic duplicates of the mother.

Republicans portray the government as the enemy. Then when they take over, they prove it.

by Chinese Democracy on 06/11/2009 06:05:00 PM EST

[ Parent ]
I claim no special knowledge on gender variation of species...I think there is a big difference talking about mammals vs. reptiles tho.

by LadyFriend on 06/11/2009 06:07:23 PM EST

[ Parent ]
the way the lizards reproduce causes mutation via genetic drift. so they dont require 2 sexes to mix chromosomes which generate more mutations.

by kingbane on 06/11/2009 06:17:35 PM EST

[ Parent ]
reptiles lay eggs   and platypus (SP) but who knows what they are lol

Republicans portray the government as the enemy. Then when they take over, they prove it.

by Chinese Democracy on 06/11/2009 06:17:52 PM EST

[ Parent ]
Is 10% really common? I hadn't heard that before. I would be interested to read more about that if you can point me in the right direction.

by LadyFriend on 06/11/2009 06:08:42 PM EST

[ Parent ]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wik i/Homosexuality_in_animals

ranges from like 8% in rams to as high as 19% in some mallards.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wik i/Homosexuality

 

this one's for human homosexuality.

by kingbane on 06/11/2009 06:19:16 PM EST

[ Parent ]
I usually talk about these stats without the numbers to back them up. Now I have them bookmarked.

by LadyFriend on 06/11/2009 05:34:56 PM EST

[ Parent ]
I would rather claim that obviously not only humans can make choices but animals too :-)

Why should homosexuality not be a choice rather than a biological determination? The "biological determination" seems to be an apology for me and why has there to be an apology in the first place? Would it be more rational to ban same sex marriage if homosexuality is choosen?

by snoewchen on 06/11/2009 05:41:14 PM EST

with animals like fish and lizards is that their brains dont really make choices in the same way. they much more genetically driven in their choices compared to mammals and great apes. what the examples of animals being homosexual shows that even when driven by mostly genetic impulses homosexuality occurs. which means it's more like being born black, asian, or blue eyed (minus the fact that those examples are inherited while homosexuality, currently has no proof of inheritance).

 

not to say that gay marriage shouldn't be allowed even if it WERE a choice. proving that it's natural is simply a destruction of one of the religious group's main arguments, that being the one where they say it's unnatural therefore it's "wrong."

by kingbane on 06/11/2009 05:49:05 PM EST

[ Parent ]
I'm not so sure that's relevant. This addresses the question of free will in a way. The degree of freedom humans actually exert (if any...i know, i know) is hugely debatable.
I'm not tryin to get a debate on free will going...that could take years, lol. I'm just saying to call something a "choice" is not really a meaningful designator.

by LadyFriend on 06/11/2009 06:05:30 PM EST

[ Parent ]

OK, I hear your second argument although the religious argument "it's unnatural therefore it's wrong" is pretty weird.

If the unnatural attribute is a rational reason for banning something, religions has to be banned foremost. Never heard about a lizard church...

by snoewchen on 06/11/2009 06:06:47 PM EST

[ Parent ]
I will use that in the future...good one!

by LadyFriend on 06/11/2009 06:10:31 PM EST

[ Parent ]

Republicans portray the government as the enemy. Then when they take over, they prove it.

by Chinese Democracy on 06/11/2009 06:18:59 PM EST

[ Parent ]
religion SHOULD be banned cause it's unnatural!

by kingbane on 06/11/2009 06:20:20 PM EST

[ Parent ]
of course, humans have dominion over other animals, so we are the only ones allowed by god to have churches.  If the lizards built a church it would be disrespectful to god.
the views expressed above are not necessarily the views of the author  
BTW, I always wondered if humans still have dominion over the lion while the human is sitting, torn up and bloody, inside the lion's stomach. (sorry for the image)

by birdboy1 on 06/11/2009 06:22:27 PM EST

[ Parent ]

Republicans portray the government as the enemy. Then when they take over, they prove it.

by Chinese Democracy on 06/11/2009 06:25:29 PM EST

[ Parent ]
I didn't "choose" to be straight, it just happened. I didn't sit around trying to decide who I thought was cute (before I knew what it even meant) in 1st or 2nd grade, it just was.

I've had gay men hit on me and I had no response, other than to be mildly flattered. I didn't chose to not feel attracted to them, I just wasn't.

PS---I don't think penguins sit around watching Will & Grace and Queer Eye For The Straight Guy. In other words, there is no societal pressure on them to be gay. It just is.

by ihavenobias on 06/11/2009 05:51:11 PM EST

[ Parent ]
If it's a choice, then persecuting it is about as bad as persecuting people who use birth control pills.  If it's biological, then the people who persecute gays are as bad as people who persecute, say, black people.

by birdboy1 on 06/11/2009 06:02:17 PM EST

[ Parent ]
The sad thing is, the religious right is starting to accept (often quietly) that being gay might be largely or entirely biological. Instead of changing their ways, they've come up with a new, possibly more damaging and obnoxious way of dealing with the issue.

Basically, they say the issue is not being gay, it's acting gay. As long as you don't talk about or touch the same sex, you're just fine! In other words, completely ignore one of the most basic, fundamental drives like priests and nuns. Just pretend you're attracted to the opposite sex, and imagine a gay lover when you have sex with your spouse while you fight your shame and guilt.

And force awkward smiles with your arm around your wife/husband.

That way you can stand proud with God, just like this guy!

by ihavenobias on 06/11/2009 06:09:01 PM EST

[ Parent ]
Can someone please pass along that info to uncle Pat!!

by LadyFriend on 06/11/2009 06:12:41 PM EST

[ Parent ]
but if that's true, then good.  Not good that they are continuing to persecute gays, but good that they are losing ground.  From there, it's easy to yell at them about life, liberty, and pursuit of happiness and force them to give more ground until their heads explode.

by birdboy1 on 06/11/2009 06:18:08 PM EST

[ Parent ]

Republicans portray the government as the enemy. Then when they take over, they prove it.

by Chinese Democracy on 06/11/2009 06:20:06 PM EST

[ Parent ]
Christofascist... did you just make that one up?
its a good one.

by birdboy1 on 06/11/2009 06:23:07 PM EST

[ Parent ]
heard Jenene Garafalo say it on radio ages ago.

Republicans portray the government as the enemy. Then when they take over, they prove it.

by Chinese Democracy on 06/11/2009 06:27:54 PM EST

[ Parent ]
you realize that most christian preachers DO this. they pretend they're not gay, lookit that doorknob that led the huge mega church. what's his name. the guy who snorted coccaine and hired male giggalo's.  TED HAGGARD! and how many of the biggest proponents of anti gay crap are ACTUALLY gay. like ALL of the senator's who hate gays turn out to be gay.  and pat robertson... COME ON! that guy is TOTALLY gay, his closet just happens to be MASSIVE.

by kingbane on 06/11/2009 06:24:14 PM EST

[ Parent ]
many a conservative frequent it lol

Republicans portray the government as the enemy. Then when they take over, they prove it.

by Chinese Democracy on 06/11/2009 06:28:44 PM EST

[ Parent ]
and preachers too. they dont consider molesting underaged boys "gay." that's considered "confusoin" by the catholic church. heheheh.

by kingbane on 06/11/2009 06:29:27 PM EST

[ Parent ]
molesting kids is some skewed thing about power  its not a gay thing.

Maybe some priests are gay and molest kids

Maybe some priests aren't gay and molest kids

Child molestation isn't a  straight or gay thing.

And why are so many child molesters priests.  Are they trying to save themselves from themselves and lose?

I mean I know why so many pedophiles are scout masters.  When looking for money you go to the bank  when looking for kids you go to.... well you get the point.

Republicans portray the government as the enemy. Then when they take over, they prove it.

by Chinese Democracy on 06/11/2009 06:36:55 PM EST

[ Parent ]
when kids get molested, they have serious mental problems.  The church helps them with them, and helps them "find god."  Then they feel so good about the church, they wanna be a priest.  Only problem is that their mental state is worse than they thought it was.  they had been abused and they go on to become the abusers.

by birdboy1 on 06/11/2009 06:41:36 PM EST

[ Parent ]
i disagree i think if you sexually molest a little boy and you're a man. you're gay. if you were straight you'd be molesting little girls.

by kingbane on 06/11/2009 06:47:43 PM EST

[ Parent ]
Ask some people that work in the field.  It's not about sex.

by Spencer on 06/11/2009 07:04:04 PM EST

[ Parent ]
 There's no such thing as a gay pedophile. There's no such thing as a straight pedophile either. You're either gay or you're a pedophile. You're not both.

Heterosexuality and homosexuality are what we call 'mature sexualities.' This stuff doesn't really become latent until puberty, but when it does it's assumed that people are looking for partners with the same physical maturity level. So mature sexuality means not just that the people are physically mature, but that they're seeking partners who are physically mature.

 And so whether you're heterosexual or homosexual, you're looking for someone on your level. You're attracted to sexual maturity.

A pedophile is not.

  more info

Republicans portray the government as the enemy. Then when they take over, they prove it.

by Chinese Democracy on 06/11/2009 07:14:34 PM EST

[ Parent ]
this is semantics they have classified hmo and hetero as adult desires not related to any other sexual "deviations" but that's semantics. homosexuality boils down to liking the same sex. lookit those female teachers who are into little boys. they're obviously hetero some of htem ended up marrying the boys they "molested." turns out she was hetero just liked little boys. i think the same can be said for preachers who like little boys. they happen to be gay AND pedo's. there's no reason why a gay person can't be a pedophile. just like there's no reason a straight person can't be a pedophile. why are there pedophiles that only target little girls, and why are there pedo's that only target little boys. CAUSE one is straight and one's gay.

by kingbane on 06/11/2009 07:35:03 PM EST

[ Parent ]
oh btw i dont disagree with you when you say pedophilia and rape etc etc is about control not so much sex. but the pedo's preference for males or females clearly show's he's gay or straight.

by kingbane on 06/11/2009 07:35:42 PM EST

[ Parent ]
It makes perfect sense

You need to re read

Republicans portray the government as the enemy. Then when they take over, they prove it.

by Chinese Democracy on 06/11/2009 09:18:45 PM EST

[ Parent ]
pedophiles dont like adults

Republicans portray the government as the enemy. Then when they take over, they prove it.

by Chinese Democracy on 06/11/2009 09:59:46 PM EST

[ Parent ]
I figure we only go around once, so if that's their bent they should go all the way.   I don't mind in the least, don't see where it's anyone else's business anyway.

by bfaul on 06/11/2009 08:30:27 PM EST

[ Parent ]

If you read the comment thread under the LA Times article, it's hilarious to see the steam rising from the ears of those who are indignant to see anyone think that this means the penguins are gay.

One really funny comment implied that the icecaps melting is God showing his wrath at these gay penguins.

After a while, you just gotta laugh...

by wyotransplnt on 06/11/2009 07:01:14 PM EST

when I read that  the icecaps are melting because god is angry at the gay penguins.

Makes me wonder what percentage of the U.S population is certifiable.

Republicans portray the government as the enemy. Then when they take over, they prove it.

by Chinese Democracy on 06/11/2009 07:29:12 PM EST

[ Parent ]
I would guess that this was a joke (gods punishment). At least I had to laugh. Next time when I pump out green house gases I will feel a little bit relieved...

by snoewchen on 06/11/2009 07:52:14 PM EST

[ Parent ]
I'll bet their cave is immaculately decorated.

by bfaul on 06/11/2009 08:31:45 PM EST

I'm pro gay-rights, but isn't all this a little biased?

Endangered penguins held in captivity with a shortage of females... are supposed to prove that homosexuality is a natural choice? Maybe it is, but i'm still not buying this article's arguments for that case. You can use the article as an example of how same sex pairings can make good parents, but there is already plenty of evidence of that.

 

LOL @ gay rights activists being outraged and stopping moves to add more female penguins,

Are they afraid that when given more options, the penguins would become heterosexual? Lock a bunch of men(or women) up together and they might have "relations" too.

And how about if gay human couples started trying to steal babies from hetero couples but ingeniously replaced them with cabbage patch dolls? LOL.

The article also claims that male penguins successfully reproduced? I doubt that's the case or even "naturally" possible, BUT, I don't doubt two male penguins are quite capable of raising a young.

Bottom line: I wouldn't take the young away, it's certainly no more unnatural than keeping them in a zoo and probably what is best for the young...

by superdestructo on 06/11/2009 08:52:18 PM EST

Over 1,500 species (at least) have homosexuality, and yes, most of that is not in captivity. And opposite sex mates are available.

by ihavenobias on 06/11/2009 09:27:31 PM EST

[ Parent ]
If they are naturally homosexual, why throw a fit about adding more female penguins? It doesn't really advance the point,

by superdestructo on 06/11/2009 09:39:31 PM EST

[ Parent ]
They are naturally homosexual, and they are throwing a fit because (in their opinions) it is like trying to repress their sexuality.  This is not the case, but thats what they think.

by birdboy1 on 06/11/2009 09:49:24 PM EST

[ Parent ]

Because that particular penguin is endangered, so they can reproduce, let em' have at it!

The more important point is that homosexuality IS 'natural' in so far as it's not a choice influenced by molestation and a liberal society. The prevalence in the animal kingdom is plenty proof of that.

 

by ihavenobias on 06/11/2009 09:49:39 PM EST

[ Parent ]

"Freedom is important to Republicans as long as someone else pays for it on the battlefield and on April 15th."

by MRFred on 06/11/2009 10:42:17 PM EST

lol I love the poll, it gave me a chuckle...  

by Erauprcwa on 06/12/2009 12:45:37 AM EST

The Million Bird March... (a sharp tuxedo affair)

by tifosies on 06/14/2009 02:53:02 PM EST

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