Call me a moron if it makes you happy.

One of the great principles of our nation is that no one is above the law.  However, occasionally our vaunted politicians forget this and they are subsequently removed from office.  It is that contract which all of us take for granted that we in turn obey the law.  For if the people begin to believe that the laws are not applied equally, then they will no longer obey them and we will have anarchy.

Now given that our "Declaration of Independence" declares that we are all equal, why is the President above the law?  It's a simple question.

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. — That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, — That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed."

Demagogue me all you want. It's a simple fact.  The constitution requires the President to be natural born.  Therefore it is the duty and expectation that our President will willingly demonstrate that he is eligible for the office he holds.  It's the law and it's his job to uphold the law, not to obfuscate and litigate it.

He has presented a "Certification of Live Birth".  This is not what is required by law.  He must present a "Certificate of Birth".  This is no small matter.  This goes to the very heart of the constitution.  The President only needs to meet three qualifications under the constitution.

Until and unless President Obama presents his "Certificate of Birth" he is in violation of the constitution.  And it is incumbent upon the Senate to remind him of this and if necessary remove him from office for failing to defend the constitution as he promised upon taking office.

If Washington is full of imperial leaders who are above the law, then there is no reason for the rest of America to obey the law either.  You can call me a racist, crackpot, dunderhead or whatever four letter word you choose, it doesn't change the facts or the law.

The President has a passport, let him show the document he used to get it. It is the President's duty and obligation to end this controversy that he himself created by claiming to have a birth certificate and then failing to present it.

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We have gone through this BS many times before & I'm not going to dwell into this again ..

p.s ... The only people making this BC an issues/controversy ... are conspiracy theorists (the issue was started by one) & Republicans. Which one are you??????

A Proud Progressive!!!

by teron678 on 03/11/2010 11:10:38 AM EST

If Obama were not natural born wouldn't he have the most bullet proof birth cert. by now? I mean, how hard would it be for someone in his position to get a forgery and plant the necessary backup info. He is the pres . Think how many slytherin sycophants he has at his disposal.

by finerbiner on 03/11/2010 11:21:54 AM EST

You're a moron. Now I'm happy.

by hazmat on 03/11/2010 11:47:50 AM EST

I am with you

Why won't he show us his gift certificate

 

This is a truly ludicrous claim.  And, oh by the way, if this is true, and the Republicans haven't seriously tried to stop him (and there's a clear difference between seriously attempting, and posturing for the cameras), the Republicans are COMPLICIT with all the things you are accusing.  Which means, logically, BOTH parties are involved in a national conspiracy to place a foreign-born national as our president.

 So, if you believe this, you need to ask yourself,

"Why do the Republicans hate America so much that they allowed this to go through?  Why would the opposition party allow this to happen?"

When you examine the internal logic to this argument, it is apparent that there isn't any.

 

Unless you want to say the Republicans and Democrats conspired TOGETHER to make a foreign-born national president.

I'm not going to call you a moron (ad hominem attacks are unconstructive), but I would posit to you that this argument makes no sense when you give it greater scrutiny.

by Rockulus on 03/11/2010 12:40:11 PM EST

That we are still a nation of laws. We are not. If we were, Bush and his entire administration would be swinging from the gallows...

by bobo1 on 03/11/2010 12:59:51 PM EST

You raise a fair point.

by MrWolf on 03/11/2010 02:04:02 PM EST

[ Parent ]


 I concur with you on the U.S. not really being a nation of laws. They've clearly been bent every which way but loose since before I was born.  And the laws apply differently depending on how much money you have

(see: Every Athlete 'punished' for breaking the law ever, more or less.  Also, Vince Neil of Motley Crue)

I was simply illustrating that if you ascribe to the 'birth certificate' thing, you have to conclude that the problem is a systemic all-encompassing 2-party conspiracy.  Not just Obama 'trojan-horsing' his way into the White House.

 I'm actually giving the Republicans a form of 'credit' here, I don't think that they would allow this whole thing to go down if they weren't involved in it themselves.  They are too dedicated to winning to let an opportunity like this just go by.  If it had any real legs (and they weren't 'in' on it), they would be all over this.  That's just sound incentive-based logic.

So, what I'm saying is either:

A) This thing has no credibility because if it did (and the Republicans weren't complicit or explicitly involved), the Republicans would have fought this election tooth-and-nail to the very end.  The stakes were too high in '08 for them to not throw the kitchen sink at this election (if they could have).

or

B) The Republicans and the Democrats have co-conspired to put a foreign-born national as our president.  We must reject the 2-party system, as they (in this scenario) have utterly failed us and betrayed our trust.  The U.S. Government is fundamentally broken and we should never trust any politician of EITHER party ever again.  It's probably time for a Revolution.

 


When you break it down like this, it kind of looks absurd.  And I think the government (inherently) is filled with crooks and corruption; it comes with power.

by Rockulus on 03/11/2010 01:30:47 PM EST

If you knew the economy was going to hell in a hand basket and whatever party was in power would get the blame and have the nightmare of trying to clean it up.  Here was an opportunity to give the Democrats a black eye and return to power in Congress just like 1994.  Our Congress is bought and paid for by special interests.

Notice I haven't claimed he was born in Kenya or even that he isn't an American.  That's not the point.  The point is that he has set himself above the law.  And by setting himself above the law he sets a precedent for future Presidents.

Be serious if McCain wanted to win the Presidency why would he have picked Palin as his running mate?  The Republicans just have to say no for 2 years until they get back power, because they know it's the economy stupid.

Don't waste your vote, vote Green or Independent in the next election.

by mcamelyne on 03/11/2010 08:10:33 PM EST

[ Parent ]
Shit is there are actually things to ride Obama’s ass about. I feel the same about the 911 Bush guys who went after Bush when there were plenty of real crimes to go after. Reality is never enough for Conspiracy Theorists.

by Alloy on 03/11/2010 01:34:21 PM EST

You're a moron.

Not only that, you're an Orly Taitz moron.

PLEASE become an endangered species, okay?

by MedfordTim on 03/11/2010 01:59:17 PM EST

Might I add: Fuck, cunt, shit, whore, Republican!

Yeah, I feel much better now!

"The first thing Fascists usually try to do is silencing the opposition."

by opposition on 03/12/2010 02:48:09 AM EST

The assumption is that there is something to hide.  Why else would a President seal all his personal records?  He works for the Americans, not the other way around.  Every American has a right to see his qualifications.  Imagine being the stockholder of a company like GE and being told you can't see any of the qualifications of the CEO.  You would go ballistic.  There is no difference.

Given the rate of change between campaign promises and delivery I am many others are unwilling to accept empty and broken promises.  If there was nothing to this it would have gone away.  Instead it will be a major campaign issue for Americans come November.

Don't waste your vote, vote Green or Independent in the next election.

by mcamelyne on 03/12/2010 08:28:53 AM EST

[ Parent ]
"If there was nothing to this it would have gone away."

Does the same go for 9/11 being an inside job, Freemasons ruling America, Kennedy and John Lennon being shot by the CIA, AIDS being invented by theUS government, Bush being a shape-shifting alien reptile, Paul McCartney died in a car crash 1966,and Belgium not existing (http://zapatopi.net/belgium /)?

Non of those theories seems to die, so there must be something to each of them.

"The first thing Fascists usually try to do is silencing the opposition."

by opposition on 03/12/2010 09:14:56 AM EST

[ Parent ]
As for the rest, you should talk to Jesse Ventura.

Don't waste your vote, vote Green or Independent in the next election.

by mcamelyne on 03/12/2010 06:33:28 PM EST

[ Parent ]
Why should I talk to Jesse? These theories are about as likely as your birther-theory. Your argument was, is there was nothing to it it would have gone away. All these theories exist even longer than the your theory, so they are even more likely.

What are we going to do about those shape shifting aliens, and why does the government want us to believe that Be;gium exists?

"The first thing Fascists usually try to do is silencing the opposition."

by opposition on 03/13/2010 04:15:50 AM EST

[ Parent ]
BUT---it doesn't make me happy.

Now I'm gonna be totally serious here, okay?  I know it's gonna sound like I'm shittin' ya and just fuckin around---but I'm not, man.  REALLY!

Would you go in somewhere and get your head examined?  I know that sounds harsh---but if you did it---and scientists would were to figure out why your mind works the way it does, it would be a GREAT thing and you would be a great man for doing it.  It would be very courageous of you---I don't think I could do it if I were you.

I'm really interested in learning why people believe that the moon landing never occurred etc.  It amazes me!

by kurd55 on 03/12/2010 09:49:12 PM EST

What am I suffering from.  A desire to see that the law is obeyed by our politicians?  Just because Obama has given you a slick presentation doesn't mean he's truthful.  Why do you hold the President to a lower standard than people are held to get a driver's license.

It sounds like you are suffering from "I want to believe" syndrome.   You probably believe that the health care reform package will make America a better place for all, too.

I don't want to believe.  I just want the cold hard facts.  I'll be happy to show my birth certificate anywhere at anytime, what's Obama's problem?  Doesn't he have one?

 

Don't waste your vote, vote Green or Independent in the next election.

by mcamelyne on 03/12/2010 11:46:13 PM EST

[ Parent ]
WHY do you believe the utterly STUPID, NON-SENSICAL, WRONG notion that a Certificate of Live Birth isn't a birth certificate, or that it isn't accepted as a birth certificate? I have gotten MANY copies of my birth certicate over the years. Know what I get? A Certificate of Live Birth. That's what states issue as birth certificates. Neither the hospital I was born in nor the county recoder of the county I was born in have copies of any hospital issued birth certificates - even THEY have to go through the state and order a Certificate of Live Birth.

Do it YOURSELF! Send away to your state for a birth certificate and see what you get sent. Maybe THEN you can move on to a REAL issue.

Obama DID present it - it is at MANY locations across the 'Net. What The Fuck More Do You NEED??

by MedfordTim on 03/13/2010 11:49:47 PM EST

[ Parent ]
I was just reading that you said:
"I'll be happy to show my birth certificate anywhere at anytime"

So can I see your birth certificate please? Can we all get a copy while your at it. I would appreciate it if I could get your social security number, address, and other personal information.
 
Are you an idiot? Do you want people to identity thieve you? Think about what you say before you say it. Unless you want to put all the information out there for everyone on the internet.

by RalphieTCLE on 03/14/2010 10:27:45 AM EST

[ Parent ]
"He has presented a "Certification of Live Birth".  This is not what is required by law.  He must present a "Certificate of Birth".  This is no small matter." 

You are basing your arguement on semantics. Puppy vs. small dog. Call it what you like, he presented the exact same document any other citizen born in the State of Hawaii would have. Different States call it different things. Hawaii calls it a Certification of Live Birth. Everyone born in Hawaii has one. Are you saying they are all forgeries?

Here are some quotes:
 
"The Health Department says the "Certification of Live Birth" is Hawaii's version of a birth certificate. Calling it by other names — Certificate of Live Birth, Certification of Live Birth — is just semantics. WorldNetDaily may be right that the original birth certificate wasn't posted, but if Hawaii says the the document Obama posted can rightly be called Obama's birth certificate, how is Gibbs lying? We harbor no delusions that anything we say here will slow the persistent drumbeat of the birthers, but we rule this statement False."

"The Hawaii Department of Health receives about a dozen e-mail inquiries a day about Obama's birth certificate, spokesman Okubo said."

"I guess the big issue that's being raised is the lack of an embossed seal and a signature," Okubo said, pointing out that in Hawaii, both those things are on the back of the document. "Because they scanned the front … you wouldn't see those things."

Okubo says she got a copy of her own birth certificate last year and it is identical to the Obama one we received."

"No, you are a paid blogger assigned to counter anyone that posts something negative about the government or Obama." by Mcamelyne II on 05/17/2011

by Robrob on 03/13/2010 12:39:13 AM EST

Certificates of Live Birth do not mean that you were necessarily born in Hawaii, further you may be adopted.

Under Hawaiian law, it is possible (both legally and illegally) for a person to have been born out of state, yet have a birth certificate on file in the Department of Health.

A. From Hawaii's official Department of Health, Vital Records webpage: "Amended certificates of birth may be prepared and filed with the Department of Health, as provided by law, for 1) a person born in Hawaii who already has a birth certificate filed with the Department of Health or 2) a person born in a foreign country" (applies to adopted children). 

B. A parent may register an in-state birth in lieu of certification by a hospital of birth under HRS 338-5.

C. Hawaiian law expressly provides for registration of out-of-state births under HRS 338-17.8.  A foreign birth presumably would have been recorded by the American consular of the country of birth, and presumably that would be reflected on the Hawaiian birth certificate.

D. Hawaiian law, however, expressly acknowledges that its system is subject to error.  See, for example, HRS 338-17.

E. Hawaiian law expressly provides for verification in lieu of certified copy of a birth certificate under HRS 338-14.3.

F. Even the Hawaii Department of Home Lands does not accept a certified copy of a birth certificate as conclusive evidence for its homestead program.  From its web site:  "In order to process your application, DHHL utilizes information that is found only on the original Certificate of Live Birth, which is either black or green. This is a more complete record of your birth than the Certification of Live Birth (a computer-generated printout). Submitting the original Certificate of Live Birth will save you time and money since the computer-generated Certification requires additional verification by DHHL."

 

Don't waste your vote, vote Green or Independent in the next election.

by mcamelyne on 03/13/2010 03:33:54 AM EST

[ Parent ]
"A. From Hawaii's official Department of Health, Vital Records webpage: "Amended certificates of birth may be prepared and filed with the Department of Health, as provided by law, for 1) a person born in Hawaii who already has a birth certificate filed with the Department of Health or 2) a person born in a foreign country" (applies to adopted children)."

From the site:

Who is Eligible to Apply for an Amendment?

An original entry on a birth, death, marriage, or divorce certificate may be amended by either the private request of an individual or an order of a court of competent jurisdiction. An amendment includes changes, corrections, additions, deletions, or substitutions.

How to Apply for an Amendment

An amendment may be made upon application, but only with the submission of required documentary evidence in support of the amendment. The evidentiary requirements can differ, depending on whether the amendment is court-ordered or, if requested by an individual, whether it materially affects the validity and integrity of the record.

Wanna point out the part which "applies to adopted children"? While you're at it, explain how anything pertaining to adopted children is relevent?

B. A parent may register an in-state birth...

What's your point? If his parents registered his birth, doesn't that tell you he was BORN there??

A foreign birth presumably would have been recorded by the American consular of the country of birth, and presumably that would be reflected on the Hawaiian birth certificate.

No. It wouldn't. The birth certificate comes from where the person was BORN. Hawaii WOULD NOT REGISTER the BIRTH of someone who WASN'T BORN THERE. My son was born in the Philippines. When he needs a birth certificate, he has to get it from there - not Hawaii or any other state or the American Consulate.

E. Hawaiian law expressly provides for verification in lieu of certified copy of a birth certificate

(b)  A verification shall be considered for all purposes certification that the vital event did occur and that the facts of the event are as stated by the applicant.

Let me repeat that...

(b)  A verification shall be considered for all purposes certification that the vital event did occur and that the facts of the event are as stated by the applicant.

Homesteading? HOMESTEADING?? What The FUCK are you TALKING about? This is a program for NATIVE HAWAIINS, not just people who happen to be BORN there!

You must be a native Hawaiian, defined as "any descendant of not less than one-half part of the blood of the races inhabiting the Hawaiian Islands previous to 1778."

Dude, you need a more productive hobby...

by MedfordTim on 03/14/2010 12:23:11 AM EST

[ Parent ]

Eventually we'll get the answer.  In fact the document Obama presented is not a certified copy of his Birth Certificate, which is what you need for a passport.

Here is the most recent filing from March 8th.  On March 22nd there will be another filing.  Eventually this case will make it to the supreme court and we will discover if Pres Obama is a natural born citizen.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/2 8042875/Kerchner-v-Obama-Ap peal-Defendants-Opposition- Brief-Filed-8-Mar-2010

Don't waste your vote, vote Green or Independent in the next election.

by mcamelyne on 03/14/2010 01:27:44 AM EST

[ Parent ]
Another challenge from birther queen Orly Taitz against President Obama's birth certificate has been thrown out of court.

U.S. District Judge David O. Carter's decision came down this morning. dismissed Orly Taitz's challenge that Barack Obama is not a natural-born citizen and so is not the country's legitimate president.

 witnesses complained Taitz wanted them to lie on the stand.

AND IN ANOTHER COURT

Earlier this month, Taitz was slapped with a $20,000 sanction by a judge in Georgia for "wasting the judicial resources" of the Middle District of Georgia with her "frivolous and sanctionable conduct."

Supreme court MY ASS...  


by Chinese Democracy on 03/14/2010 05:11:16 AM EST

[ Parent ]
This suit is from Miss Looney tunes.  This suit is from a real lawyer with a real argument.  Stay tuned, I am sure there will be more to come.

Don't waste your vote, vote Green or Independent in the next election.

by mcamelyne on 03/14/2010 06:31:57 AM EST

[ Parent ]
Can't let that go by without acknowledging it!

Thanks!

by MedfordTim on 03/13/2010 11:53:46 PM EST

[ Parent ]
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